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MyAlfaGTV6.com
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Thread: MyAlfaGTV6.com

  1. #1
    Amministratore Fiat500USA's Avatar
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    MyAlfaGTV6.com



    Some may have remembered me mentioning my Alfa GTV6 I've owned since the mid-1980s. I put my car on the back burner some 20 years ago when my son was born, but now have decided to put it back on the road. I've started a website called MyAlfaGTV6.com to document the journey and to also help others keep their GTV6s going.

    These cars were never well documented, so I bought every technical reference and repair manual, brochures and parts microfiche available when the car was new. I've got a huge reference collection, plus a lot of hands on experience to share. If you have a GTV6, or just would like to learn more about these interesting cars stop by.











    Before I parked my car, I freshened, tweaked and modified the engine and went through the other mechanicals on it. It didn't even need it! LOL. but once you own one, you can't help but fool with it. I drove it about 35K and then parked it. Time flies! Stop by the site when you can and see how I make out bringing my baby back to life.

    https://www.myalfagtv6.com/
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    5port (01-14-2023), flebus (01-14-2023), HalfPint (01-14-2023), Hermiabarth (01-16-2023), lammie200 (01-15-2023), mattsnapz (01-15-2023)

  3. #2
    Senior Member HalfPint's Avatar
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    Very cool car, I really wanted one back in the day. I thought the valve train was kind of cool, even if only 2-valve.

    47DD10D3-8A72-4E39-87D7-968337575180-705x705.jpg

    Alfa_Romeo_AR_01913-1536x1024.jpg
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  4. #3
    Amministratore Fiat500USA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HalfPint View Post
    Very cool car, I really wanted one back in the day. I thought the valve train was kind of cool, even if only 2-valve.

    47DD10D3-8A72-4E39-87D7-968337575180-705x705.jpg

    Alfa_Romeo_AR_01913-1536x1024.jpg
    Thanks. The the whole car is loaded with interesting tech. It was really different in its day. Still is. The first day I got it, I couldn't stop driving it even after a 3-hour drive home. The engine sound is hypnotic. Below is the DeDion axle.





    Here's a big picture of the valve gear. I had Shankle cams in it at one time, which had a real lumpy idle, but ripped once you got over 4,000rpm. With the headers, cat delete and full Euro exhaust it sounded like a muscle car idling and could catch you out by pegging the rev limiter in the lower gears if you weren't paying attention. They were cool, but I missed the huge low end torque these cars are known for, so I went to factory "S" cams used in the SZ and 164 Quadrifoglio. I got my torque back and still had a good power.



    It is a cool car, but I'd say be careful what you wish for. As much as I love this car, it was not an easy car to live with. It can be emotionally and physically draining to drive. Driving was an intense, visceral experience. Worrying about someone hitting it, or bending the Campagnolo alloy wheels on potholes was wearing ( I eventually bent all four) As was frequently getting stopped by traffic enforcement.

    It could be tiring too. The twin-disc clutch released low and grabbed high. First gear could crunch if you didn't pause a moment before engaging (even when new!) so the car required a lot of effort to drive in traffic. I also had a small Momo steering wheel, which didn't help.

    Parts prices were also expensive. Way more than a 'normal" 4-cylinder Alfa. The clutch was near $700 back in 1985. The guy who had it before me paid $1000 to replace it at 48K miles. Back then, Plug wires were at least $125, and I paid $300 for a rear caliper (something like $750 in todays money). The were no manuals available other than from the dealer and they were not cheap. Although my car was reliable, I did spend the money on it. If I had to pay somebody to work on it, I couldn't afford it. Especially at my income level then (and now)!
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    Senior Member HalfPint's Avatar
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    Oh yeah, the DeDion axle! Another one of my favorite designs, although I never had a car with one - in fairness they were always pretty rare. I was a bit of a geek in collage in the '80s, and even though I was an electrical engineering student I would read SAE Journals at the library. It was cool to see what was being done, and they had articles with great images and pictures.

    I think that's why I developed an appreciation for certain designs and technical approaches, and why the Italian cars appealed to me so much. Alpha Romeo, Fiat and Lancia were all coming up with really interesting and well done designs. I get a kick out of knowing what's going on underneath when I'm driving, and that there's a well designed, properly engineered system at work. Fiat's MultiAir engine brought me back because we had been looking at cam-less, electronically controlled valve train ideas back then. We were talking about something more like what Koenigsegg is working on, but the MultiAir system is close and probably more practical.

    The GTV6 was certainly interesting, and it's pretty complex and I have no doubt it's not cheap to maintain. Some of that is simply due to the scarcity, and now probably the age. I was never too sure about that engine-speed driveshaft with the clutch at the back (Porsche did it too) - were there balance issues? How is the clutch feel? It always seemed like there would be windup. At least it didn't have to articulate much. I always love the styling on them though.

    I could never really afford to take care of my Beta Zagato while trying to raise kids and restore a house, which is ultimately why I gave it away to an enthusiastic kid. It was the right choice but I dearly wish I had it now.
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  7. #5
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    I'm the same way. I enjoy the design, engineering and uniqueness. I appreciate thinking outside the box and coming up with new solutions. Or resurrecting old ones, but with a different take. The neat thing about Italian cars is the same legendary engineers and designers that came up with the iconic supercars we worship also worked on mundane cars that "normal" people could afford. In the case of Alfa, there were a lot of old-time classical engineers that did things a certain way. Like never using a stamped steel control arm. The Alfa made use of a good deal of magnesium parts, too. Just like the racecars these old engineers designed in the 30s, 40s and 50s.

    The Porsche driveline was a little different than the Alfa's by having the the clutch in the front. You couldn't really tell where the clutch was when driving. The twin disc clutches did have peculiar feel, releasing low and grabbing high. It definitely could bite hard if you were rough with it. There was no slip and the car would launch like out of a cannon if you dumped it at revs. The clutch disc(s) could also stick if the car wasn't driven a long time. I eventually replaced the twin disc with a HD single plate clutch out of the more powerful Alfa 75/ Milano, and that had a more normal feel and can still handle a lot of power. I would rather have the twin disc setup, but they are like $1200 for a used one now.

    The driveshaft's rubber donuts or Guibos as some like to call them eventually would crack and you'd have to replace them. You need to be extremely careful with marking nuts and bolts as the driveshaft was balanced. If everything was good, the engine and drivetrain were silky smooth. However, if you had a worn coupling or someone screwed up the balance, you could get an annoying vibration. Like most problems on Italian cars, it comes down to someone screwing up the job and then you suffer from their incompetence.

    The Lancia is the same way. Very interesting, but not too user friendly to repair or work on. I love them. At the shop I worked at, I worked with a guy they called Tony Fiat and I was called Chris Lancia 'cause I had a Lancia Scorpion before the Alfa. That was the heydays of Italian cars back then. Definitely not boring.




    I love reading SAE papers, too. I've been guilty of buying some.
    Last edited by Fiat500USA; 01-15-2023 at 10:34 PM. Reason: added another thought.
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    Senior Member HalfPint's Avatar
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    You know, I just realized that the Alpha GTV6 was almost a modern copy of the Lancia Aurelia! 2 door coupe with a V6 engine up front, clutch and gearbox at the back, inboard brakes, DeDion axle. Nothing wrong with following Lancia - everyone else did!
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    The rear transaxle is a smart approach to balanced weight distribution for a front engine car. Looks very similar to the setup on the C5 Corvette although the Corvette keeps the clutch in a bellhousing at the engine. The Vette even uses the same sort of rubber flex joints, except the drive shaft is enclosed inside a rigid torque tube.
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    Amministratore Fiat500USA's Avatar
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    Think about it. That was the 1950s. Lancia was an amazing company. These guys really pushed the boundaries.

    Alfa had also produced their famous, all-conquering 158/159 Alfetta racecars with the similar chassis setup starting in 1937. This rear transaxle was the hot ticket back then, but obviously too expensive for the big mass producers and series production. The old time Alfa engineers drew upon their racing days and somehow convinced the guys in charge to go for it. The Alfetta name ties in to the architecture of the racecar.

    That was 1967 and the design for the Alfetta coupe was started in 1968, but took 6 excruciating years to come out and when it did, it was right in the middle of the oil crisis and the economic downturn. That didn't help sales. The V6 design was also from the late 1960s, but didn't hit production until the late 70s. When they put it into the GTV, it gave the car a new lease on life. Still technically advanced, but with some old school engineering solutions like having to remove the cams to adjust the intake valves and setting up the rear twin piston brake caliper's pads with a feeler gauge. Working on the GTV6 is a walk down memory lane and I suppose can be compared to working on an old watch and seeing how things were done.

    The Corvette validates these ideas and concepts from so long ago. The greats like Busso, Satta, Colombo and Jano must have known what they were doing.
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    Senior Member HalfPint's Avatar
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    Yeah, they sure did know what they were doing. They were innovative and created so many of the ideas that became standard practice. I love telling Subaru fans that their cars are a copy of a Lancia Flavia/2000/Gamma.
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