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Passing Power at high speeds - Page 5
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  1. #41
    Member HalfPint's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by doverosx View Post
    I agree fully with your last paragraph and almost bought a Fiesta ST, they are great out of the box.

    Nice attempt to discredit though, you'll need to do more than that. I have looked at suspension geometry (motion ratios, suspension frequencies, etc.) and currently run custom valved shocks, bump stops and springs so I had to learn what the engineers did right before I attempted to build my own kit; I spec'd the valving and FEAL did the shim stack design. I can talk about the ECU mapping and dyno tunes I've developed as well...but sure, it's all about "some guy" with years of posting on the web.

    If you rode in my car, I am pretty sure that you'd tweak your "tune" a little bit lol. I'll post up the dyno sheet from my meth tune and a stage 1 tune from Tork, the engine is held back by the tune so much...it is crazy. Some of the "held back" part is by design, I popped my diff trying to break a drag strip record and only ended up breaking the bell housing as shards of the diff popped away, so some of the "torque limiters" are definitely there to keep the drivetrain in sync.
    Assuming your car is very well sorted out and very fast, a ride in it might impress me but would not make me want to mod mine, because I have no need for any more power on the road where I use mine. I cannot use the power it has most of the time. Even when I'm going criminally fast on backroads it's barely working. At a light if I get the drop on you it won't matter if you have double the power, you've usually already lost. The suspension ride/handling compromise suits me fine as-is.

    Product design/engineering is a process of balancing a large number of often competing requirements/constraints. Often the owner does not care about some of those requirements (noise, emissions, crash worthiness, serviceability, etc.), but also many who mod their cars are not aware of what details led to the particular choices the factory made. For example, there is a good reason the intercooler is not in the front center Assuming you are and even if you really thought that through on your mods the things you are willing to compromise on are likely not things I'd agree with.. The 500 Abarth is not perfect, and I never claimed it was. There are some bloopers there for sure, but they are mostly minor.

    And this is the heart of the issue - I was rubbished (not by you) for claiming the stock 500 Abarth has a good powerband, which it obviously does, and that perhaps the OP had unrealistic expectations of how it should be performing. It's my opinion and I'll stick with it, and I really do not care what some people I've never met think of it, regardless of how many years they've posted or what experience they have racing. The absurd thing is I'd bet a good beer you'd actually agree with it.
    Completely stock 2016 500 Abarth, Rhino & Nero

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by HalfPint View Post
    Assuming your car is very well sorted out and very fast, a ride in it might impress me but would not make me want to mod mine, because I have no need for any more power on the road where I use mine. I cannot use the power it has most of the time. Even when I'm going criminally fast on backroads it's barely working. At a light if I get the drop on you it won't matter if you have double the power, you've usually already lost. The suspension ride/handling compromise suits me fine as-is.

    Product design/engineering is a process of balancing a large number of often competing requirements/constraints. Often the owner does not care about some of those requirements (noise, emissions, crash worthiness, serviceability, etc.), but also many who mod their cars are not aware of what details led to the particular choices the factory made. For example, there is a good reason the intercooler is not in the front center Assuming you are and even if you really thought that through on your mods the things you are willing to compromise on are likely not things I'd agree with.. The 500 Abarth is not perfect, and I never claimed it was. There are some bloopers there for sure, but they are mostly minor.

    And this is the heart of the issue - I was rubbished (not by you) for claiming the stock 500 Abarth has a good powerband, which it obviously does, and that perhaps the OP had unrealistic expectations of how it should be performing. It's my opinion and I'll stick with it, and I really do not care what some people I've never met think of it, regardless of how many years they've posted or what experience they have racing. The absurd thing is I'd bet a good beer you'd actually agree with it.
    Oh, if you weren’t directing certain posts to me, because it seems we agree (?), then my parts aren’t what I would normally reply with. The stock tune is impressive actually and is highly adaptable to modifications. Seeing as you had a FiST, you are likely very familiar with how much is being left on the table. I got to race a FiST, FoST, FoRS during one event and I had a ball. The snappy steering and stiffer suspension were the biggest takeaways.


    2015 Fiat 500 Abarth
    Power:V4.1 Intake, Forge BOV, EC FMIC, 4C coils, Tork Beta Tune, ATP downpipe, Boost Leak Fix, Turbosmart WGA
    Handling: H&R 5mm spacers, El Gato Front Braces, Tork Rigid Collars, Fat Cat Motorsports Revalved Bilsteins, CPR lower brace, Fat Cat Bump Stops
    DSP/D-class (local club classing)
    #notscare

  3. #43
    Member HalfPint's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by doverosx View Post
    Oh, if you weren’t directing certain posts to me, because it seems we agree (?), then my parts aren’t what I would normally reply with. The stock tune is impressive actually and is highly adaptable to modifications. Seeing as you had a FiST, you are likely very familiar with how much is being left on the table. I got to race a FiST, FoST, FoRS during one event and I had a ball. The snappy steering and stiffer suspension were the biggest takeaways.
    I don't recall you being part of the initial discussion so I'm not sure what we'd have to disagree about. My wife's FiST is a ball and she simply loves the thing, says it's the closest thing she's driven since her old ITC BMW. The engine and chassis are really well done, and with a Cobb exhaust it even sounds nice now too - but not as nice as the Abarth. I liked the character of the 500 better though. Even with the Recaros the FiST interior just looks cheap and kind of dull, plus I find the MultiAir system to be technically interesting.

    As for what's left on the table, well there's always something faster than what you bought. Always. And in a year or two it will be obsolete, yesterday's news.
    Completely stock 2016 500 Abarth, Rhino & Nero

  4. #44
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    The truth of the Abarth: it just wasn't intended to be competitive in the "boy racer" segment of American car culture.

    The Abarth is just a fun little sporty Italian car. If FIAT had any intention for the car to be "tuner friendly" they would have given it the 16 valve "T-Jet" version of their 1.4 engine. The Multi-Air "brick" cylinder head isn't tuner friendly at all.

    Attempting to jack the Multi-Air 1.4 engine's horsepower up enough to compete with the various "boy racer" car models is just ridiculous. Yes, there are some nice improvements you can so on the car that make it a bit more fun to drive, but nothing is going to make that little 1.4 into a real performance threat to the 1.8 or 2.0 cars.
    Last edited by ewflyer; 11-27-2019 at 10:23 PM.

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  6. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by smark View Post
    Samwichse, Your old car must have been a smart car, with a 71 hp engine. I could see that vehicle achieve 41 mpg.
    It's actually a gen 1 Honda Insight. The gas engine is 66hp with a 12kw (theoretically) electric motor and a manual transmission. The combined rating is 72 hp. Terrifying in the sweepers because the rear outside wheel is always riding the bump stops so any irregularity in the pavement makes it want to snap oversteer.
    Last edited by samwichse; 11-28-2019 at 10:19 PM.

  7. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by HalfPint View Post
    If those are imperial gallons then it's equivalent to 34mpg US.
    Not imperial gallons.

    My commute is 60-65mph with traffic, and on the off-highway sections at each end I practice fuel conservation by slowing down as little as possible through the turns and traffic circles.
    Last edited by samwichse; 11-28-2019 at 10:19 PM.

  8. #47
    Member Pilothall's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by samwichse View Post
    Not imperial gallons.

    My commute is 60-65mph with traffic, and on the off-highway sections at each end I practice fuel conservation by slowing down as little as possible through the turns and traffic circles.
    Managed to get 43 MPG on my trip from Atlanta to Nashville for the holiday using these techniques haha

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