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Thread: Injector Question

  1. #1
    Member Pilothall's Avatar
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    Injector Question

    If I were to install the upgraded e85 injectors that our vendors sell would I have to run e85 or could I switch back and forth between e85 and 93? If I could switch what would be the effect on fuel economy? Would the bigger injectors spray more fuel even on pump gas? I'm assuming if I could switch at all I would need to have a specific tune for both and flash back and forth when I decided to change. This is all most likely just dreaming anyway since getting a tune and the injectors and coils that I want would be pretty expensive. But it is fun to dream and learn anyway

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    Member All Bark's Avatar
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    You’d need a bigger intank fuel pump also. I doubt anyone for this platform is running a flex fuel sensor with an appropriate tune that’ll self adjust based on ethanol content. It’s popular on my R in the vw world, along with adding port injection to go along with the oem direct injection and a bigger intank fuel pump and a gm flexfuel sensor, but I’ve never heard much about any company offering it for the fiats. So you’re likely correct, you’d need a tuner with both a gas tune and e85 tune, bigger injectors, and a bigger fuel pump or multiple pumps maybe even bigger fuel lines, and honestly it’d hardly be worth it if you weren’t going with a bigger turbo upgrade on these and at that point you’d be better off price wise just trading your fiat for a gti.
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    Senior Member aelfwyne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by All Bark View Post
    You’d need a bigger intank fuel pump also. I doubt anyone for this platform is running a flex fuel sensor with an appropriate tune that’ll self adjust based on ethanol content. It’s popular on my R in the vw world, along with adding port injection to go along with the oem direct injection and a bigger intank fuel pump and a gm flexfuel sensor, but I’ve never heard much about any company offering it for the fiats. So you’re likely correct, you’d need a tuner with both a gas tune and e85 tune, bigger injectors, and a bigger fuel pump or multiple pumps maybe even bigger fuel lines, and honestly it’d hardly be worth it if you weren’t going with a bigger turbo upgrade on these and at that point you’d be better off price wise just trading your fiat for a gti.
    Several folks have run e85 with the stock pump. I haven't done it myself so can't guarantee the pump will flow at all power levels, but so far it definitely seems doable. There's no flexfuel system available for the Fiat as you have guessed. It's either gas or e85, and you have to swap tunes if you swap fuels. Not very convenient, considering the length of time flashing takes on our PCMs. Also, yes, big turbo is where you could really begin to see the benefits of e85. The supporting mods add up at that price, as do the broken parts.
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  5. #4
    Boost Addict Lifetime Member opiateESP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pilothall View Post
    If I were to install the upgraded e85 injectors that our vendors sell would I have to run e85 or could I switch back and forth between e85 and 93? If I could switch what would be the effect on fuel economy? Would the bigger injectors spray more fuel even on pump gas? I'm assuming if I could switch at all I would need to have a specific tune for both and flash back and forth when I decided to change. This is all most likely just dreaming anyway since getting a tune and the injectors and coils that I want would be pretty expensive. But it is fun to dream and learn anyway
    Ive done it on two of my Fiats. The ATP injectors work because the 30% increase in fuel is the increase in fuel required from pump to e85. Putting pump gas in results is your car running WAY too rich. With tuning, they become optimized and the ECU is told E85 is now in the system. This will result in more power. A good tuner can scale the injectors for pump gas and can be run on a separate tune. I have never needed to replace a fuel pump and my e85 cars made 247 and 270ish whp. That said, Ive only bothered doing this with big turbos. While there may not necessarily be much of a gain for the stock turbo, its cooling properties could be a huge asset.

    Either way. Nothing wrong with dreaming about what you want to do! Sometimes you end up where you were dreaming
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    Member All Bark's Avatar
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    I’m shocked that the oem pump can flow enough for full e85, on every other car I’ve run e85 on it was the first thing that needed to be upgraded, mustangs, Sti, and my R. That’s really awesome, if true, that for whatever reason fiat stuffed a way higher flowing fuel pump than needed. It’s an odd thing for a manufacturer to have that much overkill for the fuel pump, my Sti needed a pump and injectors just to feel safe on pump gas at stage 2 levels, why they would use a pump that’s capable of flowing 30-40 percent more than they’d ever need and is presumably more expensive is really weird.

    But hey, the fiats are weird. Sometimes in a good way and this sounds like an example of it, kinda like the forged wheel option, that also just seems weird to even offer on the abarth but I’m glad they did cause I got em

    Anyway, thanks for the info on the pump, I had no idea, I’ll have to look into it a little more as e85 is plentiful by me.
    2015 Abarth (auto) moonroof, leather, Beats, forged 17s
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    EBC slotted rotors & redstuff pads
    Chrome scorpion gas door
    Shrader rear seat delete
    EC phase 0 & phase 2
    EC 4.1 version intake
    EC FMIC and piping
    Sila turbo blanket
    Defi boost gauge
    Black roof wrap
    HID headlights
    GFB DV+
    4C coils
    Tinted

  8. #6
    Boost Addict Lifetime Member opiateESP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by All Bark View Post
    I’m shocked that the oem pump can flow enough for full e85, on every other car I’ve run e85 on it was the first thing that needed to be upgraded, mustangs, Sti, and my R. That’s really awesome, if true, that for whatever reason fiat stuffed a way higher flowing fuel pump than needed. It’s an odd thing for a manufacturer to have that much overkill for the fuel pump, my Sti needed a pump and injectors just to feel safe on pump gas at stage 2 levels, why they would use a pump that’s capable of flowing 30-40 percent more than they’d ever need and is presumably more expensive is really weird.

    But hey, the fiats are weird. Sometimes in a good way and this sounds like an example of it, kinda like the forged wheel option, that also just seems weird to even offer on the abarth but I’m glad they did cause I got em

    Anyway, thanks for the info on the pump, I had no idea, I’ll have to look into it a little more as e85 is plentiful by me.
    It’s categorically true. A good tuner can have a great time with it too!
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  10. #7
    Member Pilothall's Avatar
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    Thanks for all of the responses guys! Yea I was thinking if I got a tune and the injectors then I would have the added safety of the knock protection from the e85 so I could feel comfortable running an aggressive tune. I was also thinking that if my turbo ever died then I could upgrade it instead of replace it and be all ready to go! (hopefully that doesn't happen though) Thanks for the encouragement opiateESP, your built engine is awesome and I would love to do something like that if I won the lotto haha. I do have a couple of guitars collecting dust that I might be able to sell for enough to get an OFT tune... Need to get those listed!

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