PDA

View Full Version : Would 17x8 +30 fit on a lowered Abarth?



LittleEvil
04-10-2013, 09:16 AM
like the title states, would it fit? and with what tire size do you think?

FTY
04-10-2013, 09:19 AM
Yes with a slightly stretched tire. How low is the car? A 30mm offset is almost dead flush with the fenders just keep that in mind.

LittleEvil
04-10-2013, 09:22 AM
Have not lowered yet, just thinking of getting 1552 tarmacs and that is the least aggressive size they carry. I am on the fence with the sportlines or neuspeeds, otherwise get coilovers.

mkawa
04-10-2013, 09:24 AM
i would wait until we have a good range of coilover options, particularly a good solution to the strut top mounts

LittleEvil
04-10-2013, 09:25 AM
Think it'll require fender work of any sorts? really not trying to go there. Too bad we dont have a STANCE section lol it would have helped, even though im not trying to go stance, just like the idea of the tarmac just sucks they dont offer anything less than that.

LittleEvil
04-10-2013, 09:27 AM
yea we def need more options granted we do have a few solid options. BC has always been pretty solid, and we have KW, and i read somewhere here that possibly fortune in the future.

mkawa
04-10-2013, 09:32 AM
yep, ryephile's working with fortune. hopefully someone can provide them with a mule. i'd be happy to but on the wrong side of the country. i'd like to talk to some engineers a bit about the KWs. i wonder how much testing they've done considering how fast they moved on their fitments.

there's always the bilstein wildcard. going to bug them today and see what's going on over there. RRM definitely provided them a mule, and they list a B14 fitment, but no details otherwise..

LittleEvil
04-10-2013, 09:34 AM
KW has always been a solid option, surprised to hear issues on them.

mkawa
04-10-2013, 09:42 AM
KW fitments are not always wine and roses. they use a pretty standard design and sometimes guesstimate dimensions and rates for what they think will be low-volume product.

LittleEvil
04-10-2013, 09:52 AM
Yea but that is pretty much the case with ANY coilover company. No company big volume company will invest the time in R&D for a low production setup. And if they do, its BIG money to compensate for the lack of sales in comparison to a KW V3 for an evo for example. Just business.

mkawa
04-10-2013, 09:57 AM
it depends on the size of the business. it's really all relative. there are a lot of evo and suby shops that do about as much business as we could give a shop that invested serious r&d time into our platform, for example. motorsports is a pretty niche market already..

deathshead
04-10-2013, 10:01 AM
As FTY said, +30 Offset is almost flush. its the perfect offset if you ask me, I'm running the 16x7" Sparco Terra wheels. they make the stock 16s" look like they are 4" wide with a +50 offset.

17x8 may poke a little bit and you would want to run a narrower tire, especially if your going very low.

FTY
04-10-2013, 10:16 AM
As FTY said, +30 Offset is almost flush. its the perfect offset if you ask me, I'm running the 16x7" Sparco Terra wheels. they make the stock 16s" look like they are 4" wide with a +50 offset.

17x8 may poke a little bit and you would want to run a narrower tire, especially if your going very low.

Grabbed this yesterday...with the Falkens mounted...its a decent angle so you can see how a 30mm offset looks. The car is lowered on BC coilovers. the FIAT strut mounts most likely arent going to get fixed anytime soon unfortunately, I see them a as a disposble item, swap out a suspension, swap in new strut mounts, its worth the $40 bucks to me to not run the risk of having to rip apart everything to replace them. The BCs are leaps and bounds ahead of KW V1s, which surprised me. Built in bump stops in the struts (prevent out of range operation), nice top mounted rubber bushings for the coilover spring seats and cupped front spring mounts.

http://www.eurocompulsion.net/30mmoffset.jpg

Jjm4life
04-10-2013, 10:18 AM
Fitment looks great.
As for "issues" with kw, the back doesn't go as low as some (including myself) would like. But the ride quality is great as is the overall quality of the coilover itself. Ran them through a crappy boston winter, still look brand new.

LittleEvil
04-10-2013, 10:28 AM
Grabbed this yesterday...with the Falkens mounted...its a decent angle so you can see how a 30mm offset looks. The car is lowered on BC coilovers. the FIAT strut mounts most likely arent going to get fixed anytime soon unfortunately, I see them a as a disposble item, swap out a suspension, swap in new strut mounts, its worth the $40 bucks to me to not run the risk of having to rip apart everything to replace them. The BCs are leaps and bounds ahead of KW V1s, which surprised me. Built in bump stops in the struts (prevent out of range operation), nice top mounted rubber bushings for the coilover spring seats and cupped front spring mounts.

http://www.eurocompulsion.net/30mmoffset.jpg

Aren't those 17x7 though?

FTY
04-10-2013, 10:45 AM
Yes but the offset will be the same...the backspacing will be more on a wider rim.



Fitment looks great.
As for "issues" with kw, the back doesn't go as low as some (including myself) would like. But the ride quality is great as is the overall quality of the coilover itself. Ran them through a crappy boston winter, still look brand new.

They are great coilovers but going very low or flat on the back perches will blow the struts out in a few months.

Jjm4life
04-10-2013, 11:00 AM
Hope not. 3k rough miles and everything still seems good to me

mkawa
04-10-2013, 11:09 AM
yah, fitment issues.

LittleEvil
04-10-2013, 11:11 AM
Would a 17x8 theoretically poke out an inch more then a 17x7? being they the exact same offset.

mkawa
04-10-2013, 11:13 AM
http://www.willtheyfit.com/

LittleEvil
04-10-2013, 11:26 AM
http://www.willtheyfit.com/

whats stock again? 16x6.5 what offset?

mkawa
04-10-2013, 11:27 AM
Et35

shagghie
04-10-2013, 11:29 AM
I'm running 15mm R, 10mm F spacers on the stock 17x7"s, and it looks PERRRFECT, especially the rear....car looks like an agro jackrabbit stance...so much so I may be raising the rear, stance wise, to accentuate the agro look it's created. I'm lowered on Madness CO's and a little less than 1 finger tire/well gap (can barely get a finger in there, and not perfectly horizontal either). I don't rub on the street at all, however I did rub on ONE section of a VERY rough auto-x course on a diagonal drainage ditch placed in a deep breaking/turn-in zone that was thrashing almost every ride out there (dood's battery got disco'd, a miata's undercariage came loose, fenders split, it was a nightmare!).

Anyway, doing the math.... our stock 17's are 37mm offset, so I've added 10mm spacer to that, car's lowered a decent amount, and no issues on the street at all so far.

THe Madness CO's have stiffer rates than the V1's and most all of the other CO's that Madness sells, for comparison with regards to travel/rebound effect on clearances.

LittleEvil
04-10-2013, 11:37 AM
I'm running 15mm R, 10mm F spacers on the stock 17x7"s, and it looks PERRRFECT, especially the rear....car looks like an agro jackrabbit stance...so much so I may be raising the rear, stance wise, to accentuate the agro look it's created. I'm lowered on Madness CO's and a little less than 1 finger tire/well gap (can barely get a finger in there, and not perfectly horizontal either). I don't rub on the street at all, however I did rub on ONE section of a VERY rough auto-x course on a diagonal drainage ditch placed in a deep breaking/turn-in zone that was thrashing almost every ride out there (dood's battery got disco'd, a miata's undercariage came loose, fenders split, it was a nightmare!).

Anyway, doing the math.... our stock 17's are 37mm offset, so I've added 10mm spacer to that, car's lowered a decent amount, and no issues on the street at all so far.

THe Madness CO's have stiffer rates than the V1's and most all of the other CO's that Madness sells, for comparison with regards to travel/rebound effect on clearances.

the 17x8 +30 would still be a pretty significant difference. Using that fitment calculator looks like it'll be an issue :/

shagghie
04-10-2013, 11:45 AM
The new BFG Rivals seems to run actually NARROWER than even a larger width R1R, though...so that may help if they end up making the right profile height for your set up in those tires...

https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/392651_474096325994649_125914079_n.jpg

BTW, adding a video of him with the Rivals on his Yaris at Nationals:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=FEHoLYIogPk
Looks like turn in is pretty quick! lol!

Last update, just heard this from the guy above about his Rivals when I asked him why they are narrower:
"I think it might just have to do with how the Rivals are cantilevered.
As of right now though, the 205/50/15 Rival has been pulled from the market for some cosmetic tread splice problems which I was unlucky enough to have happen to me. But TR is doing a good job to keep me happy" -Yaris Dude

LittleEvil
04-10-2013, 12:27 PM
The new BFG Rivals seems to run actually NARROWER than even a larger width R1R, though...so that may help if they end up making the right profile height for your set up in those tires...

https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/392651_474096325994649_125914079_n.jpg

BTW, adding a video of him with the Rivals on his Yaris at Nationals:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=FEHoLYIogPk
Looks like turn in is pretty quick! lol!

Last update, just heard this from the guy above about his Rivals when I asked him why they are narrower:
"I think it might just have to do with how the Rivals are cantilevered.
As of right now though, the 205/50/15 Rival has been pulled from the market for some cosmetic tread splice problems which I was unlucky enough to have happen to me. But TR is doing a good job to keep me happy" -Yaris Dude

Some tires are like that. for example federal tires run a size larger, for example a 205 looks like a 215.

LittleEvil
04-10-2013, 12:29 PM
If i end up going too wide, i'll end up going all in and having it super fitted and low, then i will tear up my inner lining and likely **** up my fenders which in return will lead to body work and lets not forget replacing or respraying my front bumper after a few months due to excess scuffing and bottoming out lol. I have zero self control.

shagghie
04-10-2013, 12:40 PM
If i end up going too wide, i'll end up going all in and having it super fitted and low, then i will tear up my inner lining and likely **** up my fenders which in return will lead to body work and lets not forget replacing or respraying my front bumper after a few months due to excess scuffing and bottoming out lol. I have zero self control. Sounds just about right... i always feel like...hey worse thing happens you scrape your fenders and then you need to get 10mm flares, roll the fenders underneath, and go even lower! These types of occurrences have been known to happen!

LittleEvil
04-10-2013, 12:45 PM
Sounds just about right... i always feel like...hey worse thing happens you scrape your fenders and then you need to get 10mm flares, roll the fenders underneath, and go even lower! These types of occurrences have been known to happen!

YUP lol. or max out turbo, blow motor, build motor and scrap stock turbo since now your built motor, throw on big turbo. Make huge power, go to the drag, get kicked out for not abiding by NHRA rules, go home get a cage done, say **** it strip the rear, and before you know it, 9 sec non legal street car is parked being never driven and your rolling around in your beater having ppl wonder where your nice car is lol.

2Cool
04-10-2013, 01:02 PM
YUP lol. or max out turbo, blow motor, build motor and scrap stock turbo since now your built motor, throw on big turbo. Make huge power, go to the drag, get kicked out for not abiding by NHRA rules, go home get a cage done, say **** it strip the rear, and before you know it, 9 sec non legal street car is parked being never driven and your rolling around in your beater having ppl wonder where your nice car is lol.

Dude, sounds like you found my old website on my '94 Mustang build, that went from handling street car to fat/skinny supercharged 408cid stroker trailer queen money pit. Cause that story was me till I got sick of it.

LittleEvil
04-10-2013, 01:52 PM
Dude, sounds like you found my old website on my '94 Mustang build, that went from handling street car to fat/skinny supercharged 408cid stroker trailer queen money pit. Cause that story was me till I got sick of it.

its happened to the best of us lol. "yea just going to throw a few bolt ons and daily this ****" a year later your taking pictures of you in the engine bay smiling lol.

mkawa
04-10-2013, 01:57 PM
there's always the bilstein wildcard. going to bug them today and see what's going on over there. RRM definitely provided them a mule, and they list a B14 fitment, but no details otherwise.. called bilstein west (in poway, socal) today and was told that

a) they are planning on bringing over the european version of the B14 PSS coils but with modifications to the top to fit the different mount sizing (smaller, unsurprisingly). the units will use the stock top mounts. eta a few months.

b) i was told in no uncertain terms that no one in the US (i mentioned RRM specifically) has a bilstein sourced suspension for a NAFTA fiat.

c) they have no information on valving or spring rates for the US version of the B14 kit. nothing is available at the moment except for an eta.

LittleEvil
04-10-2013, 02:17 PM
called bilstein west (in poway, socal) today and was told that

a) they are planning on bringing over the european version of the B14 PSS coils but with modifications to the top to fit the different mount sizing (smaller, unsurprisingly). the units will use the stock top mounts. eta a few months.

b) i was told in no uncertain terms that no one in the US (i mentioned RRM specifically) has a bilstein sourced suspension for a NAFTA fiat.

c) they have no information on valving or spring rates for the US version of the B14 kit. nothing is available at the moment except for an eta.

that's awesome. unfortunately a few months might be too long of a wait for me lol

mkawa
04-10-2013, 02:38 PM
not sure where else to put this, but i also spoke to KW about the variant 3s.

1) the rear dampers are the old style with the silly pin shaped tool for compression adjustment.

2) the struts are meant to use the entirety of the (horrible) stock upper spring mount.

3) the lower spring perches are 62mm, so there's no spring compatibility with any other vendor!

4) progressive springs all around. people seem to hate the spring rates (which he couldn't give me), so scratch that as well!

shagghie
04-10-2013, 03:30 PM
I could offer up my Abarth to Bilstein in they still need a test car...

SuperTony
04-10-2013, 03:41 PM
LittleEvil - I just put 17 x 7.5 30mm BBS wheels on my ABARTH. I installed 215/35 Yokohama S-Drive tires and have no fitment issues. I can share pics if that would help. I think 8 inches wide would get into issues.

LittleEvil
04-10-2013, 03:52 PM
LittleEvil - I just put 17 x 7.5 30mm BBS wheels on my ABARTH. I installed 215/35 Yokohama S-Drive tires and have no fitment issues. I can share pics if that would help. I think 8 inches wide would get into issues.

please share pics.

shagghie
04-10-2013, 04:37 PM
+1!!!!
please share pics.

mkawa
04-10-2013, 05:26 PM
i believe these would be the bbs cs4s?

LittleEvil
04-10-2013, 06:28 PM
5735

Looks like HG motorsports is running them in matte black, they are on coilovers.

Jjm4life
04-10-2013, 06:33 PM
Damn that car is ugly.

LittleEvil
04-10-2013, 06:46 PM
Damn that car is ugly.

LOL yea it is, but it does have the cs4's and a good idea of the fitment.

mkawa
04-10-2013, 07:06 PM
they fit pretty well afaict, and i think my tirerack contact confirmed this. like the neu-f wheels, they seem to have been designed for the hub's eccentricities (i mean, it's circular, but it's weird).

Deefourtay
04-10-2013, 07:47 PM
http://www.1010tires.com/Tools/Wheel-Offset-Calculator Looks like the 17x8s would extend out an extra 20mm compared with the OEM 17s. I think 17x7.5 between +30 & +35 is good for those that like a proper tire setup, none of that sketchy stretched tire business.

RickG@eurocompulsion.net
04-10-2013, 07:53 PM
8 wide 30mm is 13mm more aggressive inner and outer, compared to the 7 +30mm

SuperTony
04-10-2013, 08:53 PM
Yes. I have the BBS CS4 in Anthracite. Here are some pics - terrible I know but it is already dark here. I will take a few more in the morning light tomorrow.

Link to the rims...
http://www.tirerack.com/wheels/WheelCloseUpServlet?target=wheelCloseUp&wheelMake=BBS&wheelModel=CS4&wheelFinish=Machined+w%2FAnthracite+Accent&tab=wheels

57365737

My personal advice, don't go wider than 30 offset and 7.5 wide on a 17 inch rim. Feeling around my setup there is very little room and it was a relief to realize I had no rubbing and all was well. I was rather stressed about it before installing - here is a shot of the 215/35 tire width compared to the 195/40 stock.
5738

Deefourtay
04-10-2013, 09:12 PM
Nice wheels SuperTony! Looks like they fit well.

LittleEvil
04-10-2013, 09:28 PM
Yes. I have the BBS CS4 in Anthracite. Here are some pics - terrible I know but it is already dark here. I will take a few more in the morning light tomorrow.

Link to the rims...
http://www.tirerack.com/wheels/WheelCloseUpServlet?target=wheelCloseUp&wheelMake=BBS&wheelModel=CS4&wheelFinish=Machined+w%2FAnthracite+Accent&tab=wheels

57365737

My personal advice, don't go wider than 30 offset and 7.5 wide on a 17 inch rim. Feeling around my setup there is very little room and it was a relief to realize I had no rubbing and all was well. I was rather stressed about it before installing - here is a shot of the 215/35 tire width compared to the 195/40 stock.
5738

Nice. Are you lowered?

2Cool
04-10-2013, 10:15 PM
Damn that car is ugly.

Looks like someone really wanted a Veloster.

mr_robs
04-11-2013, 04:02 AM
that's awesome. unfortunately a few months might be too long of a wait for me lol

Same here, I'm looking to buy coils as my first mod (maybe a power pedal first, not sure what brand to go with). Most likely going to purchase a set in a month unless something great is confirmed and worth waiting for.

Super glad someone started this thread though, great discussion and info to be had for Abarth noobs like myself

SuperTony
04-11-2013, 06:59 AM
Nice. Are you lowered?

Yes. Just installed the ST Coilovers two days ago. They are nice so far but I am still tweaking the setup. Very much a work in progress since it is not my daily driver. She sits in the garage and waits for me to work on her and take a drive on the weekends :-)

I am thinking I will switch the suspension to the KW v3 or the madness set in case anyone wants a deal on *like new* ST coilovers :-0

Link to the ST coilovers:
http://500madness.com/500madness/shop/index.php?route=product/product&path=267&product_id=839

SuperTony
04-11-2013, 08:28 AM
Morning photos. Also - for your reference. Checkout the 500madness.com website under "Customization". There is a grey Fiat with bright orange rims. I inquired about those rims when I was figuring out what to do with mine. Those are 18 inch rims with a 30mm offset. Since that car is so lowered you can get a feel for how the tire fills the wheel well. I think those rims are 18x7 so you can see an 8 inch rim will make contact.

57445745

LittleEvil
04-11-2013, 09:28 AM
Morning photos. Also - for your reference. Checkout the 500madness.com website under "Customization". There is a grey Fiat with bright orange rims. I inquired about those rims when I was figuring out what to do with mine. Those are 18 inch rims with a 30mm offset. Since that car is so lowered you can get a feel for how the tire fills the wheel well. I think those rims are 18x7 so you can see an 8 inch rim will make contact.

57445745

that looks really good tony, id lower it a tiny bit more.

SuperTony
04-11-2013, 09:48 AM
Yeah... It is tempting. I was playing around with the front the other night - here is a photo (note: those are 16inch rims!)
5749

BigT
04-11-2013, 10:05 AM
yep, ryephile's working with fortune. hopefully someone can provide them with a mule. i'd be happy to but on the wrong side of the country. i'd like to talk to some engineers a bit about the KWs. i wonder how much testing they've done considering how fast they moved on their fitments.

there's always the bilstein wildcard. going to bug them today and see what's going on over there. RRM definitely provided them a mule, and they list a B14 fitment, but no details otherwise..

I live in VA unfortunately I don't live close enough to let them have my car and also don't have a backup vehicle to drive if they did need it for extended periods. But fortune makes amazing quality stuff and they are good people.