PDA

View Full Version : Article: Dodge Hits the Mark With the All-new 2013 Dodge Dart Compact Car



Fiat500USA
12-29-2011, 10:38 PM
You can view the page at http://www.fiat500usaforum.com/content.php?191-Dodge-Hits-the-Mark-With-the-All-new-2013-Dodge-Dart-Compact-Car

F500
12-30-2011, 03:41 PM
hey Chris.....you're slippin'! LOL

posted 12/6/11:

http://www.fiat500usaforum.com/showthread.php?4379-Dodge-to-Reintroduce-the-DART!&highlight=dart1:

F500
12-30-2011, 03:48 PM
sorry, but I don't understand all this "Tigershark" stuff. "Multi-Air" I get......but this isn't a Tiburon, its a Dart. guess I'm just too old to 'get it'. as for the car itself, I'll have to put my opinon of it on hold until I see and drive one myself. pics look cool though. :)

Fiat500USA
12-31-2011, 01:45 AM
hey Chris.....you're slippin'! LOL

posted 12/6/11:

http://www.fiat500usaforum.com/showthread.php?4379-Dodge-to-Reintroduce-the-DART!&highlight=dart1:

I know, I posted on my site the same day (New Dodge Dart Channels Alfa Romeo DNA (http://www.fiat500usa.com/search/label/Dodge%20Dart))

I wanted to have the press release here on the forum for reference for everyone.

Fiat500USA
12-31-2011, 01:54 AM
sorry, but I don't understand all this "Tigershark" stuff. "Multi-Air" I get......but this isn't a Tiburon, its a Dart. guess I'm just too old to 'get it'. as for the car itself, I'll have to put my opinon of it on hold until I see and drive one myself. pics look cool though. :)

I was surprised by the Dart and the 'Tiger Shark' name. I am looking forward to driving it. Hope it is a home run for them.

littlejohn
01-03-2012, 08:47 AM
2.4 good....

KhalilWilliams
01-04-2012, 05:53 AM
I was surprised by the Dart and the 'Tiger Shark' name. I am looking forward to driving it. Hope it is a home run for them.

I hope so, too! :) That car seems mighty promising! Although, I'm not sure if I would really want to just deal with a sedan. Pardon my preference, but hatchbacks are the way to go for me.

Felnus
01-07-2012, 08:44 AM
908

Pretty sweet! I'm not a sedan guy either but that is a very sharp ride.

Jeepnut
01-07-2012, 05:40 PM
I hope so, too! :) That car seems mighty promising! Although, I'm not sure if I would really want to just deal with a sedan. Pardon my preference, but hatchbacks are the way to go for me.
Insiders say it's a sedan style hatch so hang tight for the reveal

Jeepnut
01-07-2012, 05:41 PM
sorry, but I don't understand all this "Tigershark" stuff. "Multi-Air" I get......but this isn't a Tiburon, its a Dart. guess I'm just too old to 'get it'. as for the car itself, I'll have to put my opinon of it on hold until I see and drive one myself. pics look cool though. :)
Tigershark is the name of the revised WGE family just like the 1.4 is called FIRE

Felnus
01-07-2012, 05:52 PM
Insiders say it's a sedan style hatch so hang tight for the reveal

Take a look at my post above this one. Its not a render, it is an official Dodge photo. More are available including interior shots and various details inside and out but none show an open hatch, they might be holding that back as a surprise. The under the passenger seat storage is a very nice touch though.

http://www.caranddriver.com/photo-gallery/2013-dodge-dart-news

panther76
01-08-2012, 12:02 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wrdxDk_jWkQ&feature=player_embedded

meh. i think that car will have a really tough go against the current competition. an unadjusted mpg of 40, which i think will translate to something in the mid-upper 30's on the sticker.

corolla will be new in 2013
current elantra
focus
civic (to get an early refresh due to all the criticisms
cruze

i think the dodge dart will find itself at the botoom of this food chain.



....but its got to be better than the caliber. has to be.

luckymoi
01-08-2012, 03:29 PM
For me the Dart is just another car... there are lots of cars using the wedge design paradigm and too much lighting.
I also don't care for the central touch screen. The two small fords have it and the new G35/37 has it as well as others;. No thanks.
Lots of people disagree with me... that's fine.
I've not seen the dash on the mito/giulietta and hope to see Alfa here in my lifetime, lol!

GileraWarren
01-08-2012, 08:44 PM
[url]

corolla will be new in 2013
current elantra
focus
civic (to get an early refresh due to all the criticisms
cruze

i think the dodge dart will find itself at the botoom of this food chain.

I think we need to keep this forum on topic which is Fiat 500 because I don't think you can get lower on the food chain than Elantra, Kia , Corolla,
and I don't think this is the place for that discussion

panther76
01-08-2012, 09:25 PM
I think we need to keep this forum on topic which is Fiat 500 because I don't think you can get lower on the food chain than Elantra, Kia , Corolla,
and I don't think this is the place for that discussion

what are you talking about?

the TITLE of the thread is Article: Dodge Hits the Mark With the All New Dodge Dart Compact Car

and when discussing the compact segment, the corolla and civic still own the segment with the focus and elantra being very strong entrants into the segment.

these are clearly the cars the Dart will compete against.

PFVA63
01-08-2012, 09:50 PM
Hi,

Surprisingly (or not), it looks like the Chevy Cruze outsold the Honda Civic last year and came fairly close to the Toyota Corolla last year.

http://blog.iseecars.com/2012/01/07/best-selling-compact-cars-in-2011/

Regards

Pat

Fiat500USA
01-08-2012, 11:29 PM
I think we need to keep this forum on topic which is Fiat 500 because I don't think you can get lower on the food chain than Elantra, Kia , Corolla,
and I don't think this is the place for that discussion

While I agree you can't go lower on the food chain than the Elantra, etc., the Blog has always featured all the cars from Fiat SpA and now that Fiat controls Chrysler, don't be surprised that these cars will be discussed here. We may put them in their own forum at some point. After driving some of the new offerings from Chrysler, I was really surprised by some of them (I lean heavily towards European cars).

By the way, that was a little harsh of me on the Hyundai comment. Those cars cannot be under estimated now. Some of them are impressive.

panther76
01-09-2012, 09:18 PM
Hi,

Surprisingly (or not), it looks like the Chevy Cruze outsold the Honda Civic last year and came fairly close to the Toyota Corolla last year.

http://blog.iseecars.com/2012/01/07/best-selling-compact-cars-in-2011/

Regards

Pat

the tsunami clearly was a main contributing factor.

as soon as toyota got inventory up it was right back on top. for example, toyota sold almost 5,000 more corollas than chevy sold cruzes in december......and chevy continues to depend more on fleet sales than toyota.(though less than they used to)

panther76
01-09-2012, 09:21 PM
By the way, that was a little harsh of me on the Hyundai comment. Those cars cannot be under estimated now. Some of them are impressive.

yes it was. i thoroughly shopped all the compacts and subcompacts when i needed to replace my 500. i ended up with the 12 accent (and another hyundai as well), which i chose over the fit, sonic, versa, and others. i think im a pretty smart and objective consumer, and have always been a toyota/honda loyalist.

still, if fiat gives the 500 that telescoping wheel, i will be back at a studio the next day.

PFVA63
01-09-2012, 09:33 PM
the tsunami clearly was a main contributing factor.

as soon as toyota got inventory up it was right back on top. for example, toyota sold almost 5,000 more corollas than chevy sold cruzes in december......and chevy continues to depend more on fleet sales than toyota.(though less than they used to)

Hi,

The Tsunami may well be a contributing factor in the lower sales of some Japanese models, but at the same time I'd really suspect that the decline in Civic sales may also be due in part to issues with their new model.

Just some thoughts

Pat

panther76
01-09-2012, 09:51 PM
Hi,

The Tsunami may well be a contributing factor in the lower sales of some Japanese models, but at the same time I'd really suspect that the decline in Civic sales may also be due in part to issues with their new model.

Just some thoughts

Pat

even with all the flak the new civic has taken, once inventories were up, it ousold the cruze by 4000 units in december.

people will still buy the corolla and civic in mass as long as they make them simple and reliable.

PFVA63
01-09-2012, 10:17 PM
Honda was running some pretty big sales promotions throughout December though.

Regards

Pat

Fiat500USA
01-10-2012, 12:01 AM
yes it was. i thoroughly shopped all the compacts and subcompacts when i needed to replace my 500. i ended up with the 12 accent (and another hyundai as well), which i chose over the fit, sonic, versa, and others. i think im a pretty smart and objective consumer, and have always been a toyota/honda loyalist.

still, if fiat gives the 500 that telescoping wheel, i will be back at a studio the next day.

Yeah, that was an off comment because Hyundai and Kia have some interesting designs. Ignore them at your peril because they are cleaning the clock on a lot of the 'established' marques out there. The good news is that this will keep everyone on their toes.

GileraWarren
01-10-2012, 12:17 AM
yes it was. i thoroughly shopped all the compacts and subcompacts when i needed to replace my 500. i ended up with the 12 accent (and another hyundai as well), which i chose over the fit, sonic, versa, and others. i think im a pretty smart and objective consumer, and have always been a toyota/honda loyalist.

So let me see if I understand this. You got rid of a 500 because you thought an Accent was a better car. You think the new Dart is at the bottom of the food chain. And the Caliber is the worst car ever made......... So what are you doing on this Forum?????? Wouldn't your time be better spent on some Asian Forum? I'm sure your comments would be better appreciated there.

Fiat500USA
01-10-2012, 01:13 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wrdxDk_jWkQ&feature=player_embedded

meh. i think that car will have a really tough go against the current competition. an unadjusted mpg of 40, which i think will translate to something in the mid-upper 30's on the sticker.

corolla will be new in 2013
current elantra
focus
civic (to get an early refresh due to all the criticisms
cruze

i think the dodge dart will find itself at the botoom of this food chain.



....but its got to be better than the caliber. has to be.

Unadjusted of 41mpg so 40mpg on sticker. Also, besides possibly the Ford, the Dart promises to have better driving dynamics than the others. Equipment and content are also a strong point. Specification wise, the car looks like a strong contender and not a 'bottom feeder'. LOL

PFVA63
01-10-2012, 01:39 AM
Seeing that the new Cruze looks like it did pretty well this year, I would be surprised if the Dart doesn't do well, as well.

Pat

geeded
01-10-2012, 02:19 AM
Unadjusted of 41mpg so 40mpg on sticker. Also, besides possibly the Ford, the Dart promises to have better driving dynamics than the others. Equipment and content are also a strong point. Specification wise, the car looks like a strong contender and not a 'bottom feeder'. LOL

The ace in the hole that the Dodge has over the Ford Focus is the transmission choice. The Ford Dual Clutch has been less than successful and they only offer the manual in the lowest model (that's the one everyone seems to like).

It appears that a 6-spd manual will be available with all the engines and (hopefully) all the levels of the Dart. It will be interesting to see the driving difference /times between the Turbo (less hp, more torque) and the 2.4 multi-air (more hp, less torque).

With the Dual-clutch only available on the Turbo, makes me think that will be an option on the 500 next year, assuming that's the smaller sized version I've heard about (so it can fit). That would certainly help with the mileage on auto 500's.

I've not been a Chrysler fan in many years, but this bodes well for the future. Now if they could just do something about the dealers. It's like going into a shark tank.

Cheers

panther76
01-10-2012, 07:10 AM
Unadjusted of 41mpg so 40mpg on sticker. Also, besides possibly the Ford, the Dart promises to have better driving dynamics than the others. Equipment and content are also a strong point. Specification wise, the car looks like a strong contender and not a 'bottom feeder'. LOL

the unadjusted of 40 (according to the guys at clean mpg) will be more like 36-37 on the sticker. they may be wrong.

panther76
01-10-2012, 07:14 AM
So let me see if I understand this. You got rid of a 500 because you thought an Accent was a better car. You think the new Dart is at the bottom of the food chain. And the Caliber is the worst car ever made......... So what are you doing on this Forum?????? Wouldn't your time be better spent on some Asian Forum? I'm sure your comments would be better appreciated there.

first, you complain that the dart is being discussed on a thread about the dart.

next, you suggest i leave and go to some "asian" forum. this, after making your own conclusion about why i dont have my 500.

you have contributed 2 posts to this thread and they have both been to complain about either the thread or a poster.

may i suggest this thread may not have anything you are interested in discussing.

panther76
01-10-2012, 07:20 AM
Seeing that the new Cruze looks like it did pretty well this year, I would be surprised if the Dart doesn't do well, as well.

Pat

again, the cruze had all the advantages that it will ever have with inventories on the civic and corolla being severely limited. that will not happen in 2012.

even with the corolla having an old and dated look according to critics, it and the civic will outsell the cruze in 2012. the civic is getting a very early makeover and the corolla will be new in 2013.

is the cruze better than any compact gm has had to offer in the past? no dubt about it. i even included it in the tough competition the dart will be facing.

i think most compact buyers are just looking for dpendable, fuel efficient transportation that is comfortable. there is a reason the civic and corolla have been so popular despite their "simpleness."

the 99% of buyers...who never join internet car forums....arent interested in driving dynamics so much.

panther76
01-10-2012, 07:34 AM
It appears that a 6-spd manual will be available with all the engines

Cheers

yes, i applaud this choice. i also hope they dont limit it to the base model of each engine choice. i sense they wont, but we shall see. im tired of seeing many manufacturers assume if you want a manual trans, you are looking for the budget experience.

PFVA63
01-10-2012, 12:11 PM
again, the cruze had all the advantages that it will ever have with inventories on the civic and corolla being severely limited. that will not happen in 2012.

even with the corolla having an old and dated look according to critics, it and the civic will outsell the cruze in 2012. the civic is getting a very early makeover and the corolla will be new in 2013.

is the cruze better than any compact gm has had to offer in the past? no dubt about it. i even included it in the tough competition the dart will be facing.

i think most compact buyers are just looking for dpendable, fuel efficient transportation that is comfortable. there is a reason the civic and corolla have been so popular despite their "simpleness."

the 99% of buyers...who never join internet car forums....arent interested in driving dynamics so much.

Hi,

I'm not sure that I'm understanding your math. If the Corolla is new for 2013, I'd suspect that would typically mean the new model would likely go on sale late this year (Sept or so). Similarly, the articles that I have read also suggest that the Civic revamp won't happen till late this year as well. As such, it would appear that you still have one older model and one newer model that isn't doing so well going up against the relatively new Cruze model and the soon to be brand new Dart model.

After seeing the unveil for the Dart and reading up a bit more on it, it very muchly seems to have a lot to offer that the older Corolla and current Civic may have a hard time competing against (not to mention the cars on offer by hyundai and Ford as well). As such, I'm not really seeing why anyone should just assume that Corolla and Civic numbers should increase this year just because previous version have sold well against weaker competition than it appears that they will face this year.

Regards

Pat

panther76
01-10-2012, 02:03 PM
he new civic has been so criticized
Hi,

I'm not sure that I'm understanding your math. If the Corolla is new for 2013, I'd suspect that would typically mean the new model would likely go on sale late this year (Sept or so). Similarly, the articles that I have read also suggest that the Civic revamp won't happen till late this year as well. As such, it would appear that you still have one older model and one newer model that isn't doing so well going up against the relatively new Cruze model and the soon to be brand new Dart model.

After seeing the unveil for the Dart and reading up a bit more on it, it very muchly seems to have a lot to offer that the older Corolla and current Civic may have a hard time competing against (not to mention the cars on offer by hyundai and Ford as well). As such, I'm not really seeing why anyone should just assume that Corolla and Civic numbers should increase this year just because previous version have sold well against weaker competition than it appears that they will face this year.

Regards

Pat




im not sure of the argument. how are the corolla or civic not doing so well against the cruze? they both sold 20,000+ cars in december. the cruze sold about 16,000. once inventories were brought back up to normal, they both outsold the cruze by a fair margin. the corolla has been around for almost 3 1/2 years and many call it outdated and boring. the new civic was such a disappointment that honda admitted as such and scheduled a heavy refresh after only a year.

the cruze has been around long enough that everyone knows about it.

still, the cruze was easily outsold by both cars in december. the ONLY reason the cruze outsold those cars much of the year is because there was a severely limited supply of them. neither toyota or honda bas rebuilt on there inventory yet and the cruze stil isnt outselling either one.

add to that the cruze has a higher percentage of sales going to fleets and the difference in consumer sales is even greater.

any new models/refreshes of the corolla/civic will only push their sales up. the loyalty on those cars in incredible. im not even saying they are the best cars in the class overall. but, they are dependable and efficient and people trust them. it is hard to overcome that.

looking at year end data for 2011; somehow, even with the tsunami destroying inventory levels, the corolla still sold about 9,000 more cars than the cruze and the civic only about 10,000 less. chevy wont have that tremendous advantage in 2012.

imo, it will be a long time before the corolla or civic have a tough time competing in the class. the numbers prove that people will buy them as much as they are available and remain dependable.

bottom line, the Dart will compete against a super tough class. it will need to be plagued by as few problem possible in a new car. my chrysler loving friends already think it looks very unappealing, so i will be interested to see how well the public embraces it.

PFVA63
01-10-2012, 03:37 PM
I'm not sure that the data necessarily supports the suggestion that the Corolla and Civic's number were down last year primarily just because of the Tsunami, nor that they have recently been dominating the market for their size category in the US recently.

Here is a plot of data from the website GoodCarBadCar.Net for the Corolla, Civic, and Chevy's competitor over the last several years.

922

As shown in the graph, sales for both the Corolla and Civic have been on a bit of a downward trend since about 2006 for the Toyota and 2008 for the Honda. Additionally, the trend for Chevy's competitor has show a recent upswing. For Chevy, 2002-2003 this car was the Cavalier, with the Cobalt begining to phase in (with the Cavalier phasing out) between 2004 and 2006 (I think? if I am understanding correctly). The 2008 & 2009 numbers are solely for the Cobalt, and in 2010 towards the end of the year the Cruze began sales. the 2011 numbers include a total of 856 Cobalts (out of a total of 232,588 units sold) the rest being Cruzes.

Additionally, here are a couple piecharts for October and November of last year showing the breakdown in "Small Car" sales in the US (these were the latest two graphs available on the GoodCarBadCar.Net site).

923
924

As you can see from the October chart, while the Corolla/Matrix and Civic combined account for just under 20% of the market, there is just over 80% of the market left to be divided up by the likes of the Chevy, VW, Hyundai, Nissan, and others. As such, while the Corolla/Matrix may have the largest share in both months, other cars have come close to their share and overall it doesn't really seem to be "dominating" the segment, nor really is the combination of the Corolla/Matrix and Civic together.

Regards

Pat

panther76
01-11-2012, 01:28 AM
imo it would be a safe bet that the corolla will be the best selling compact car for the next 10 years with the civic close behind. yes, there are other solid choices that werent available even 10 years ago. the above information just illustrates how hard it will be for a newcomer, which was my initial point on the dart.

japanese makes did start to get hurt before the tsunami because of the strong yen. the fact that they still sold as many or more compacts than companies without these disadvantages says something.

i expect the cruze saw as much market share as it will ever see in 2011.

Fiat500USA
01-11-2012, 02:03 AM
I don't take people seriously when they are dismissing the Dart without even seeing the car in person. I've heard the comment that 'it doesn't look like a Dart' which, to me, is a bizarre comment (and I owned a 70 Duster). I think that is a fringe element, though. With the features the car comes with, the pricing and the looks, it seems to be competitve.

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-nJnlnL48U68/Tw0kjUFHePI/AAAAAAAAKwM/8pcjAmqp5XU/s640/1963_Dg_Dart_GT_2dr_rt_color.jpg

panther76
01-11-2012, 08:07 AM
I don't take people seriously when they are dismissing the Dart without even seeing the car in person. I've heard the comment that 'it doesn't look like a Dart' which, to me, is a bizarre comment (and I owned a 70 Duster). I think that is a fringe element, though. With the features the car comes with, the pricing and the looks, it seems to be competitve.

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-nJnlnL48U68/Tw0kjUFHePI/AAAAAAAAKwM/8pcjAmqp5XU/s640/1963_Dg_Dart_GT_2dr_rt_color.jpg

i mostly agree. while i think it will be less popular than most the other established compacts once the initial sales die down, it still looks like a much more legitimate entry into the market than the caliber. there are some old dart lovers who really hate this new car, but i doubt if most of the consumers of this car will remember the old dart.

ive said that it will have a tough go in the current compact market, and i still feel that way. however, that does not exclude it from being a decent car.