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MrFiat
11-23-2011, 07:27 PM
The question of the Abarth price keeps popping up and as one "not-so-rich" guy that's getting "not-so richer" every day, I can totally sympathize with that consideration. But what I'm hearing is NOT so much the cost of the car, but the difference in cost between competing cars. That's a different matter altogether.

So let's level the playing field a little and then find out what's really important to you in a vehicle. Here's a hypothetical question for you to ponder. The answer you end up with may not be as easy to arrive at as you might first think. In fact, for some of us, an acceptable answer may be impossible. You don't have to answer "aloud" but rather give some serious consideration in your own mind as to what is most important to YOU when choosing a vehicle. It's a good reference point when trying to sort out your options.

The conditions of the question I'm about to pose are preposterous but go with it anyway. Let's say that every vehicle in the world, new or used, of any size, any make, any model and with any option you wanted would cost you just ONE Dollar to buy! All other costs, fuel, maintenance, operating expense, everything else, remain as they are. (Now here's the rub) -- You can only have two cars --ever--. You could have them serially or both at the same time. (Go with the flow here. You wreck it, too bad. Get it fixed!.)

So here's the question: Starting from today and going forward,

Of all the vehicles that exist today, (or have ever existed), foreign or domestic, Large or small, which two vehicles would you choose to own? and why?

Consider Utility, practicality, longevity, maintenance, and long term enjoyment. (Parts will always be available). Think carefully, because once you make your decision, you can't change your mind! You're going to have to live with your choice for the rest of your life! It all boils down to what a car really means to you. When (IF) you arrive at an honest answer, you'll have a good reference point from which to measure the true value (to you) of the new 500 Abarth, or any other car you may be considering for that matter.

I'm not quite sure I can answer my own question yet, but I think I'm zeroing in on one. How about you? -- :indecisiveness:

buzzny
11-23-2011, 07:34 PM
I'm not ignoring you, just thinking of how evil you must be. This is going to take some serious time for me to answer. You really need to move out of that snowbelt. It's effecting you:)

MrFiat
11-23-2011, 07:53 PM
I'm not ignoring you, just thinking of how evil you must be. This is going to take some serious time for me to answer. You really need to move out of that snowbelt. It's effecting you:)

LOL !!! Evil ain't the word for it --:devilish: -- The winters here in Siberiacuse will freeze your *** off. It'll also shrivel your --- ummm --- thinking! :friendly_wink: So, ----- do I get a "sympathy pass" in the evil department? :stupid:

buzzny
11-23-2011, 08:07 PM
I just don't want you to EVER forget that I was tired of lake o'fect snow and got outta dodge! (Umm..Maybe Dodge isn't a good example.) I'm thinking your choice vehicle might be a snow cat.....

PFVA63
11-23-2011, 08:07 PM
I think that since I couldn't be sure how long a car would last, I'd try and go for owning them sequentially, and try and put off buying the 2nd car for as long as possible, till I felt that I really needed it (such as if the 1st car is beginning to get too old to keep running or if my life changes significantly - such as having several kids etc).

Since I guess we're assuming that you might buy your 1st car in your mid to late teens, but wouldn't know when/if you would ever marry or have kids, making a 1st decision would be a big challenge.

For the 1st car then I'd guess I'd go for something with good utility and low operating/maintenance costs. My thoughts then are for a 5 door hatchback, but I don't know which. Overall though it seems like a newer car (with better safety and efficiency features than older cars) would make most sense.

Eventhough these cars weren't available when I was 16-17 years old, looking at current 5-doors, that could include the Hyundai Accent, the Ford Fiesta, the Chevy Sonic, the Nissan Versa, or the Toyota Yaris and the like, though I might also consider a Hybrid like a new Prius V or something.

My choice on a 2nd car would then have to wait till I see how my life begins to turn out. If I were to stay single, I might make a choice different than if I were to start a family.

Just some thoughts

Pat

buzzny
11-23-2011, 08:11 PM
I think that since I couldn't be sure how long a car would last, I'd try and go for owning them sequentially, and try and put off buying the 2nd car for as long as possible, till I felt that I really needed it (such as if the 1st car is beginning to get too old to keep running or if my life changes significantly - such as having several kids etc).

Since I guess we're assuming that you might buy your 1st car in your mid to late teens, but wouldn't know when/if you would ever marry or have kids, making a 1st decision would be a big challenge.

For the 1st car then I'd guess I'd go for something with good utility and low operating/maintenance costs. My thoughts then are for a 5 door hatchback, but I don't know which. Overall though it seems like a newer car (with better safety and efficiency features than older cars) would make most sense.

Eventhough these cars weren't available when I was 16-17 years old, looking at current 5-doors, that could include the Hyundai Accent, the Ford Fiesta, the Chevy Sonic, the Nissan Versa, or the Toyota Yaris and the like, though I might also consider a Hybrid like a new Prius V or something.

My choice on a 2nd car would then have to wait till I see how my life begins to turn out. If I were to stay single, I might make a choice different than if I were to start a family.

Just some thoughts

Pat
Economics major in college or an accountant presently? No evil intended really, just having some fun Pat.

Ya'll know I can't wit 'till we all meet some day. Probably a bunch of ya are picking turns on whacking me with a bat...Sorry, Baaaaaaad day at the 4 letter word (w o r k):)
- Jeff

MrFiat
11-23-2011, 08:29 PM
I think that since I couldn't be sure how long a car would last, I'd try and go for owning them sequentially, and try and put off buying the 2nd car for as long as possible, till I felt that I really needed it (such as if the 1st car is beginning to get too old to keep running or if my life changes significantly - such as having several kids etc). Since I guess we're assuming that you might buy your 1st car in your mid to late teens, but wouldn't know when/if you would ever marry or have kids, making a 1st decision would be a big challenge. For the 1st car then I'd guess I'd go for something with good utility and low operating/maintenance costs. My thoughts then are for a 5 door hatchback, but I don't know which. Overall though it seems like a newer car (with better safety and efficiency features than older cars) would make most sense. Eventhough these cars weren't available when I was 16-17 years old, looking at current 5-doors, that could include the Hyundai Accent, the Ford Fiesta, the Chevy Sonic, the Nissan Versa, or the Toyota Yaris and the like, though I might also consider a Hybrid like a new Prius V or something. My choice on a 2nd car would then have to wait till I see how my life begins to turn out. If I were to stay single, I might make a choice different than if I were to start a family. Just some thoughts Pat

And good ones they are. It's true. Everyone's situation is different. But if YOU were to start right now, right where you are in life at this moment, what would you choose to do going forward? Same rules apply.

sjmst
11-23-2011, 08:43 PM
1) A BMW 3 series (probably an e46 vintage).
2) A Ferrari 355.

But I'd not be happy. How about 4 cars? lol.
Then I'd add an Abarth 500 and a Jeep Grand Cherokee

cmj912
11-23-2011, 08:44 PM
Funny you should mention it. With all the talk about the sales and who-is-going-to-buy-it and blah blah about the Fiat, someone's finally asked the correct question :)

Very few of my ideal cars are sold here. The 500 is my ideal car (at least for right now) because it is the only thing in that price bracket that's sold in the US. All of my other I-wish cars are small European or Japanese city cars like:

Renault Twingo/Clio
Citroen C2, C3 and C3 Pluriel
Peugeot 107, 208, 207cc
Volkswagen Lupo/Polo/Fox/Up!
Lancia Ypsilon
Fiat 500/Panda/Punto
Subaru R2

Some of these cars are no longer sold, they just represent my ideal of the type of car that comes in a small package with features once considered luxury or near luxury and are very unique and distinctive. As a single person for whom a car is a tool, it is important to me to own something both appropriate to my personality and for my needs. As one person who uses a car to commute and to get from A to B, I like to do it in something stylish and fun and configurable. I don't need massive cargo or people carrying capacity, just something I enjoy during the daily grind. Traditionally, our offerings here in the US have been small, spartan, anonymous-looking and dull. Finally with the 500 we have something that is both affordable in many iterations and still gives a nod to a distinctive design while remaining a comfortable and competent automobile.

Honestly I wish more people saw that. The Fiat is "not this" and "not that". For most people living in or near an urban area I feel like we don't really think much about what we DO with the car when we think about wanting it. Also, the US doesn't provide any of the benefits Europe or Asia does as an incentive to only drive the nicest version of what you NEED - such as lower taxes for the "kei jidosha" class of car in Japan. Maybe if we did, we'd understand why in Norway or Tokyo a VW Golf Diesel is considered a family car. Every morning I wonder what all of those single-driver Escalades and Tahoes are thinking. Do they need the car for kids? Dogs? Massive shopping trips? Does that 4'9 foot person driving the Suburban NEED to take up that much real estate to feel like heor she is "something"? I don't know. Nothing against them, I guess I just feel judged for WANTING and LIKING small cars.

You will note that I left out the MINI. While the MINI is a good car for most of its life here I could not afford to buy one new. So I welcome Fiat slipping in at under the cost of a MINI. I just lucked out and was able to buy the Fiat new and with more options than I'd have been able to get on a MINI. Had I gone with one it probably would have to have been used.

epb
11-24-2011, 03:12 AM
1) A BMW 3 series (probably an e46 vintage).
2) A Ferrari 355.

Close! :) The correct answer would be:

1) BMW 330i ZHP (E46 series, made from 2003-2005) - a near-perfect meld of performance and luxury in a daily driver
2) BMW Z4 M Coupe/Roadster

MrFiat
11-24-2011, 11:37 AM
Interesting choices! -:encouragement:- Please keep them coming. I'd like a Ferrari as well but couldn't imagine being able to afford a lifetime of maintenance. Of course, when I win the lottery that would all change! -- :smug: -- Keep in mind this exercise is completely subjective and a matter of pure personal preference. So anything goes. If every car in the world cost a buck and I could only have two --ever-- I would still choose to own a small car. Considering factors such as practicality, performance, durability and pleasure of ownership, I found my personal choices reduced to a mere handful. I simply have no use for a "ho-hum" dull car.

My ideal car must be fun to drive, get exceptionally good gas mileage, be comfortable and safe in all kinds of weather, and have a good deal of flair and individuality to it. In my opinion there aren't a lot of cars that fall into that category. But I do think the Fiat 500 does. I agree with Pat. I would have my two cars serially, hoping something more suitable might come along in the future.

So here's the answer to my own question:

According to the rather severe rules of this game, sadly, the '60 Abarth would have to go but it would be replaced by one of the new Abarths, probably the 500A or the 500ATF (it's a tough call). I think it meets all the requirements I might have for a long term vehicle. With the extra power, it could pull along a small trailer if the need arose for moving larger items.

My second choice I'm leaving open. Bottom line? Having lived with the 500 Sport for a while now, I think I would be quite happy driving the 500A for the rest of my life. For the 2nd car, I might even opt for a second one in a different color or maybe buy my '60 back just for the fun of it.

Doodles
11-24-2011, 04:32 PM
It would be a process of elimination
All Japanese cars would be eliminated. (appliances)
All Korean cars would be eliminated.
I,d probably go With my fiat and a porche of some kind.

F500
11-24-2011, 06:22 PM
What's MY ideal car?

an SRT8 Challenger 6.1L HEMI 6sp. that is if gas is back down to a buck-fifty a gallon and insurance companies weren't such greedy SOB's! LOL but since gas is over $3 and insurance companies are NOT so customer-friendly, I'll stick with my 500 Sport as my 'ideal car'.

but change some circumstances and you'd be hearing a rumbling, deep throated HEMI pulling our of my garage every morning.

PFVA63
11-24-2011, 07:45 PM
And good ones they are. It's true. Everyone's situation is different. But if YOU were to start right now, right where you are in life at this moment, what would you choose to do going forward? Same rules apply.

After thinking about it for awhile, starting today, overall I guess it may change a little, but not enough overall. In general I really like my current 500 Pop, but if I had to convince myself of a car that I might have to keep for 20-30 years, since I really like small hatchback type cars, in the end I guess I'd still lean a little more towards a 5 door over a 3 door, and I think I'd prefer a modern car for safety and efficiency, maintenance concerns.

Looking at the available options, the Honda Fit just doesn't seem to do it for me, and while I kind of like the Toyota Yaris, its interior leaves me even a little down. Also, I just don't know enough about the new Chevy Sonic, so that more or less leaves the Nissan Versa, Ford Escort or Hyundai Accent. Though, there still is maybe a slight possibility of an overseas only car like the Fiat Panda or Hyundai i10.

In the end though, eventhough I don't like the current body style as much as previous versions I guess I'd go for a Hyundai Accent for my 1st car, mostly because of its good warranty, efficiency, and fairly high ratings by owners (I previously owned an Accent several years ago myself).

For a 2nd car though, that's really hard to say. I'd be really temtpted to say something like the Honda FCX Clarity (http://automobiles.honda.com/fcx-clarity/) Fuel Cell Vehicle, or something else similarly high tech, but I just don't know if these type cars are destined to be around for awhile or if they are just transitional stuff that may be gone fairly quickly, so I'm still thinking.

Regards

Pat

PS. Although I'm an Engieenr now, I did study accounting for a while at college :)

johnnyquest
11-25-2011, 11:46 PM
I was going to say a Porsche and an Audi, or a Ferrari and a Fiat, but I'm thinking more about the question and I'm thinking I need to be more practical in case my career takes a crazy turn. I do think I would go with one cheap and reliable runabout and one performance car.

1. 1992 MK2 VW GTI 16v in red. Fun. Practical. Cheap.

2. 1990 Porsche 911 Carrera 4 in Guards Red. Beautiful, fast, comfortable, classic.

I'm sure I'm forgetting some of my favorite older cars, and I think the newer 911s would be great to own as well, but I think I could honestly go the rest of my life with just these two cars.

Wait, no I couldn't...

What about the NSX? The Ferrari California? The new Abarth? The JCW Mini Cooper? The Lotus Elise? The Mustang GT?

I couldn't do it...

JQ

sportbiker
11-26-2011, 03:39 PM
If parts and service were available and reasonably priced, my picks would be a Citroen DS21 and an X1/9 1.5.

Jeepnut
11-26-2011, 05:03 PM
I can't do one ideal car but I can go top 5 new cars
1 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited customized by AEV with 6.4 Hemi, lift,snorkel, ect..
2 Ferrari 458 Italia in Red with black and tan interior
3 Alfa Romeo 4C
4 Fiat 500C Abarth Rosso Brilliante with white Esse Esse wheels and stripes
5 Maserati Gran Tourismo coupe because I think it has the sexiest exhaust note ever!!!!

Fiat of Denver
11-26-2011, 10:01 PM
two? I only want one. http://www.unicatamericas.com/photos_international.html

FiatGusto
11-26-2011, 10:13 PM
two? I only want one. http://www.unicatamericas.com/photos_international.html
now that is a rv!!!

Reaperman
11-26-2011, 10:46 PM
I've been thinking this over for days now, and have come up with one single answer.
A Toyota MR2 Spyder.

The answer was easier to find than I thought, since its the car that I gravitate towards in video games. So yes, when supercars are an option, I beat an MR2 to death instead. Did it all day. No doubt I'd need some degree of tuning on it to be happy, or heck, here on fantasy day even the GT300 car. My first car was mid-engined, and I've always wanted to go back. The MR-S is nice and light, has a convertible top to let the sky in, and I have no need for any more practicality than it provides.

I guess the big question mark is if I actually fit inside one...

Jim McKenzie
11-30-2011, 12:21 PM
I thought about this provocative question and realized my answer changes as I get older. Decades ago I would have said a Ferrari 308 Spider...until I drove one. I loved the Lotus Europa at the time (1970-72?) but today the car looks a little...ugly.

I loooked at the MR2 for a bit, but found the interior and exterior to be incongruent...the exterior looks like a sports car, the interior doesn't to me. However, I am biased, being an X1/9 guy I've always had spome sort of inferiority complex with that car...I think it was better built, better dealer-supported than the X.

I DO think that whatever I would get for the two cars would HAVE to have at least one Italian car. I'd absolutely love to have a Lancia Stratos to play with on weekends, (although the suspicion exists that it might be another 308 experience) and I'd love to have an automatic transmission Fiat 128 4-door to drive as my daily driver.

My first owned car was a 1969 Camaro, and the new Camaro evokes a lot of nostalgia for me, but it's interior is truly both Spartan and cheap looking.

My current car is aq Mazda 3, a five door hatch. The car has a high utility value and I use the "storage" all the time. I'd hate to give that up...

I *do* love both my current X1/9 and the 850 Spider. I would not give up the 850 for anything, except perhaps death.

Sooooooo, my two cars would be: A Fiat 128 (with auto) as my daily driver, and a Fiat 850 Spider for weekends. Although honestly I want the X too :) (click small images below to supersize)

649

652

Nocciola
11-30-2011, 01:34 PM
Cayman R
Subaru WRX hatch

MrFiat
11-30-2011, 07:00 PM
I would not give up the 850 for anything, except perhaps death.
649
652

Now You've done it! Got me drooling over that Amazing Stratos! My Abarth OT-1000 Spyder looked almost identical to your 850 and was the same color too. Wish I still had it. Death be damned. I suggest you take the 850 with you when you go ! LOL