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View Full Version : Installing a 240V Charger at home on a Separate Meter - My Experience



Mr_Shush
04-14-2014, 12:42 AM
Yes, I did it. It is not for the weak. It takes a lot of coordination and a lot of patience. Not to mention, around $2500 - $3000.

Here are some stats/tips:

1) I purchased a Bosch 30 amp 240V 25ft cord from Amazon. It was around $700. Get the extra length for the cord. You will be glad you did.
2) I reached out to Bosch for an estimate to install. They sent two separate contractors and i also requested a quote from a contractor I have used in the past. I highly recommend getting multiple bids.
3) Do your research. Know your home's electrical system, where you want the charger installed, what type of plan your utility will offer, and when you use your power. I live in Aracdia, CA. It made more sense for me to keep my home on the "Tier" plan and have my EV on a separate meter. You may be able to tap into your existing panel without a separate meter. Different for everyone.
4) The Bosch recommended installers were pricey. I would find an electrician you trust and go that route. Don't be fooled into thinking the manufacturer of whatever charging unit you select is better equipped to install. You will need an electrician that knows what he is doing.
5) the electrician i went with charged $1600 to install a pull box, sub-panel, meter socket, run about 75 feet of conduit to my garage, install a emergency shut-off in the garage, and wire the unit. This was not an easy job. Installing a pull box (essentially a splitter that sends power from your feed to your home panel and your EV panel) is a major task.
6) it cost another $400 to patch and repair the stucco.
7) all in, $2700. The CA rebate covered $2500 of that cost. Knowing i have 240V charging ability at home was well worth this investment in time and money. The whole process took about 3 weeks from opening my permit to getting Edison out to slide in the second meter.

Here is what I did in chronological order:

1) called Edison and told them I wanted to install a charging unit on its own meter. They sent out a planner to make sure it could be done.
2) after Edison blessing, pulled the permit with Arcadia. Cost was about $45.
3) received bids for work and selected my contractor.
4) put my contractor in touch with Edison planner so they could coordinate on what exactly needed to be done.
5) purchased Bosch unit.
6) once electrician was done, called City of Arcadia to sign off on permit and release work to Edison. City contacts Edison directly.
7) Edison came out to look at the work. Once the planner blessed it, scheduled the Edison crew to come out and tie in the line and install the meter.
8) it took Edison about 10 days to send a crew out.
9) I am up and running.

I will post some pics. If anyone has any questions about the process just post here and I will be happy to answer.

DaveN007
12-20-2014, 03:53 PM
Yes, I did it. It is not for the weak. It takes a lot of coordination and a lot of patience. Not to mention, around $2500 - $3000.

Here are some stats/tips:

1) I purchased a Bosch 30 amp 240V 25ft cord from Amazon. It was around $700. Get the extra length for the cord. You will be glad you did.
2) I reached out to Bosch for an estimate to install. They sent two separate contractors and i also requested a quote from a contractor I have used in the past. I highly recommend getting multiple bids.
3) Do your research. Know your home's electrical system, where you want the charger installed, what type of plan your utility will offer, and when you use your power. I live in Aracdia, CA. It made more sense for me to keep my home on the "Tier" plan and have my EV on a separate meter. You may be able to tap into your existing panel without a separate meter. Different for everyone.
4) The Bosch recommended installers were pricey. I would find an electrician you trust and go that route. Don't be fooled into thinking the manufacturer of whatever charging unit you select is better equipped to install. You will need an electrician that knows what he is doing.
5) the electrician i went with charged $1600 to install a pull box, sub-panel, meter socket, run about 75 feet of conduit to my garage, install a emergency shut-off in the garage, and wire the unit. This was not an easy job. Installing a pull box (essentially a splitter that sends power from your feed to your home panel and your EV panel) is a major task.
6) it cost another $400 to patch and repair the stucco.
7) all in, $2700. The CA rebate covered $2500 of that cost. Knowing i have 240V charging ability at home was well worth this investment in time and money. The whole process took about 3 weeks from opening my permit to getting Edison out to slide in the second meter.

Here is what I did in chronological order:

1) called Edison and told them I wanted to install a charging unit on its own meter. They sent out a planner to make sure it could be done.
2) after Edison blessing, pulled the permit with Arcadia. Cost was about $45.
3) received bids for work and selected my contractor.
4) put my contractor in touch with Edison planner so they could coordinate on what exactly needed to be done.
5) purchased Bosch unit.
6) once electrician was done, called City of Arcadia to sign off on permit and release work to Edison. City contacts Edison directly.
7) Edison came out to look at the work. Once the planner blessed it, scheduled the Edison crew to come out and tie in the line and install the meter.
8) it took Edison about 10 days to send a crew out.
9) I am up and running.

I will post some pics. If anyone has any questions about the process just post here and I will be happy to answer.

I guess I should consider the fact that the car is paying for more than itself as an opportunity to invest in this type of set up.

Greg Elmassian
12-21-2014, 02:58 AM
Why did you get a separate meter?

My choice was a separate meter on TOD, or my entire house on TOD. Unless I lit my house with candlelight and used an abacus instead of a computer, it makes more sense to have my entire bill on TOD...

I guess the rates are set up different, please explain.

Greg

DaveN007
12-22-2014, 01:33 PM
Why did you get a separate meter?

My choice was a separate meter on TOD, or my entire house on TOD. Unless I lit my house with candlelight and used an abacus instead of a computer, it makes more sense to have my entire bill on TOD...

I guess the rates are set up different, please explain.

Greg

A separate meter would mean that my pool pumps running at 1AM would still be racking up top-tier kWh $$$.

Even if the separate meter delivered power to the car at $0 per kWh it would be a bad idea for me.

I am curious, also.

Candles are actually a lot more expensive, Greg. LOL.

Greg Elmassian
12-22-2014, 04:29 PM
Ok so just one candle ha ha!

Mr_Shush
01-17-2015, 12:00 PM
I have a 3,000 sq ft home that is filled with people all day. TOD does not make sense for me. My house is on the Tier plan and car is on EV plan. I hit Tier 4 on the house very quickly each month. EV is 11 cents per kWh with a charging window between 9:00 pm and noon the next day.

DaveN007
01-19-2015, 04:36 PM
I have a 3,000 sq ft home that is filled with people all day. TOD does not make sense for me. My house is on the Tier plan and car is on EV plan. I hit Tier 4 on the house very quickly each month. EV is 11 cents per kWh with a charging window between 9:00 pm and noon the next day.

Interesting. I have a family of 6 in 5000, so we used to be into the highest tier very quickly.

Maybe PG&E is different. Based upon smart meter data they projected savings moving to EV-A, and by moving some easy to schedule usage to off-peak times we have saved a ton on our electric bill. An INCREASE in usage of 300 kWh a month has LOWERED bill by an average of $125 thus far. Highest TOD rate is only slightly higher than top tier...but we have some control.

Summer will be interesting. Running whole house fan will cost 1/4 as much, and we can pre-cool with AC when needed at 1/2 to 1/4 the cost.

DaveN007
01-19-2015, 04:49 PM
I have a 3,000 sq ft home that is filled with people all day. TOD does not make sense for me. My house is on the Tier plan and car is on EV plan. I hit Tier 4 on the house very quickly each month. EV is 11 cents per kWh with a charging window between 9:00 pm and noon the next day.

Interesting. I have a family of 6 in 5000, so we used to be into the highest tier very quickly.

Maybe PG&E is different. Based upon smart meter data they projected savings moving to EV-A, and by moving some easy to schedule usage to off-peak times we have saved a ton on our electric bill. An INCREASE in usage of 300 kWh a month has LOWERED bill by an average of $125 thus far. Highest TOD rate is only slightly higher than top tier...but we have some control.

Summer will be interesting. Running whole house fan will cost 1/4 as much, and we can pre-cool with AC when needed at 1/2 to 1/4 the cost.

Mr_Shush
01-21-2015, 03:56 AM
These were my options at SCE:

https://www.sce.com/wps/portal/home/residential/electric-cars/residential-rates/!ut/p/b1/tVfLcqM6EP0VzyJLFY0eSCxx4jjg-BU7mcQblyREhpRfsZnU3Pv1VyRMZTBlsCe-bEyb0wfpSH3UODPn0Zmt5Fv6LLN0vZKLPJ55c1d0g5twAmH3fh pA2L5quzf9EGBALeDJAuDAFcB7vt-Fzk00tPnTMYGQjGEwCQIC4DnfnZkz06tsk_1wnnbazPV6lZlVN jerCyjuL2Brdmls71K5uACzMDrbphppud19hq08bP2BbG1lZnY 5_0ansfOkuEc8xRSSngJEQVMkY-YjwhIupafdOKHv6O36xVLmKZ6vNVAApGMTI5oQgRTTCUoSX3Ch wRXULSSomWNJQnH7wK2E3cn4YfQAN31S5NcASvlD1gX7uNPt9d tT8K_wfn4VUH5_m3TsYxgOgrsAehwq768Ayvk9Qu1j2pkOL3G3 N6rmVwDl_Gk3p--B_zDChHJeya8AavInHqnPzwF5fhReBW6X4lBcBh4EYhx4rDfGl-K3fjWAhhJ438INRdBUBrPaTcJxAyDfJHvDvOMYwuihcztsuxhE laEq8x7DiNl1jPgUOJ-44prXM-RCP1kl-cFB3mNn8lmNbkKkSShDQGODaMwpErFgtrSkjLEm1IDfQNhhXyU sL6awC3EqYXREdacvr6-zwNpcbme_MufxoM_pn7tsvTTb1u7nZrPeZvvj3avtKflzvInnc hlrhexqYmtWypoVVgzFEAsRG-bFBDcR0nMTeicTRkf43d8ras-S_FQoflqJfK1ssnJhXJdmILALsYslSgS3B4JnZyAJ5ohTP46NA Zz4pIFwQL5KOBzltd0Oojvw_faVz08mjI7w5OM1Pnw610sx6ZQ cgficARMS4cQjiFLlIimZRonvE-qDxzyJGwj77KuEe9q2ycmE0RHn1Tm0LbYw0j_k9jldPaP1Jm_a qpqXz2PmljwuxoKAxCjRxvZEruJIKcmQq8BlmgA3ijYQjviZCR k9mTA6okf5S81_28Xnf-ijr9yfRLltGpRkZra_FEokSLrEHiUi3zjchsK1bkgNI8q4DYSc n5lwQE8mjI5oJc8n82YhV8UcDjVnw5I5M5wwpRlBhLPc-myrr0zMkfG58sHaIXi6mEN9O_h_lqeFvc3zR3K3S3eZXGX1TQl clzztqI-YBkI4NyE-mTA64rvyPKvQ9Hm4Wd4vBVmi-4_rEdIwDV_Y5u3fabJczvuZAFJE35FURXSbDAZFtHizsI_oH_K RZKOZ2oc9f_v2H_1Zi8M!/dl4/d5/L2dBISEvZ0FBIS9nQSEh/#/accordionGrp1-2/accordionGrp1-1/accordionGrp1-3

EV Plan works best for me.

Greg Elmassian
01-21-2015, 04:35 PM
I have almost the same exact situation as Dave, 4000 sq ft, only 2 people but lots of stuff, TV's computers, etc.

Solidly in tier 4 every month about 2,000 kWh .... even in the summer when the TOD charged me 49 cents, the much lower rates the other hours made the difference. Even in the winter I am saving significant $$, it's over $200 a month savings in the summer. In either summer or winter the rates are lower except for 12 noon to 6 pm in the summer (only 1 cent higher on peak in the winter).

I followed the link, gives you some info, but does not show the actual rates in $$.... do you have those? Would like to compare the tier plan to the TOD rates with real numbers.

Not trying to give you a hard time, just does not compute. Now if you said you never get out of tiers 1 and 2, that makes sense. if you got part way into tier 3, my calculations showed it was near the tipping point, but for me, being in tier 4 every month, it clearly came out to go TOD.

Greg

LaMesa500e
01-22-2015, 01:28 PM
Slightly off topic but we are 2 in 2400 with Solar from Solar City. The agreement guarantees tier 1 rates 24/7 for 20 years, starting year 1 at 16.2 cents and increases limited to 2% per year. When SDGE tier 4 goes to 60 cents, we might be at something like 24 cents. It's a great package. I sold the Expedition for the 500e.... that alone saved about $275 a month in gas savings. There is no benefit for TOU or separate metering in this setup.

DaveN007
01-23-2015, 02:39 PM
Slightly off topic but we are 2 in 2400 with Solar from Solar City. The agreement guarantees tier 1 rates 24/7 for 20 years, starting year 1 at 16.2 cents and increases limited to 2% per year. When SDGE tier 4 goes to 60 cents, we might be at something like 24 cents. It's a great package. I sold the Expedition for the 500e.... that alone saved about $275 a month in gas savings. There is no benefit for TOU or separate metering in this setup.

The perfect storm would be support for a separate meter for the car at the 9 to 10 cent-ish rate.

My understanding is that is not possible with solar yet, but may be at a point in the future.

Some of the solar plans are a no-brainer if you look at it from an investment perspective. It is a guaranteed return that is higher than most options today. Because of government subsidy, of course. I have to replace my roof first. I have a big roof.

It might be better to move.

Mr_Shush
02-10-2015, 02:08 PM
I have almost the same exact situation as Dave, 4000 sq ft, only 2 people but lots of stuff, TV's computers, etc.

Solidly in tier 4 every month about 2,000 kWh .... even in the summer when the TOD charged me 49 cents, the much lower rates the other hours made the difference. Even in the winter I am saving significant $$, it's over $200 a month savings in the summer. In either summer or winter the rates are lower except for 12 noon to 6 pm in the summer (only 1 cent higher on peak in the winter).

I followed the link, gives you some info, but does not show the actual rates in $$.... do you have those? Would like to compare the tier plan to the TOD rates with real numbers.

Not trying to give you a hard time, just does not compute. Now if you said you never get out of tiers 1 and 2, that makes sense. if you got part way into tier 3, my calculations showed it was near the tipping point, but for me, being in tier 4 every month, it clearly came out to go TOD.

Greg

My house meter is on Schedule D rate plan:

Tier 1 = .15 346 up to kwh
Tier 2 = .19 104
Tier 3 = .27 243
Tier 4 = .32 anything over 693 kwh

My car is on the EV plan which is a flat .11 per kwh between 9:00 pm and noon the next day. Here are the options I had:

1) Connect EVSE to open breaker on house panel and remain on Schedule D plan for both house and car.

2) Connect EVSE to open breaker on house panel and change plan to TOU Residential plan for both house and car.


Rates:


.47 per kwh peak (2:00 pm - 8:00 pm)


.30 per kwh off peak (8:00 pm - 10:00 pm & 8:00 am - 2:00 pm)


.11 per kwh super off peak (10:00 pm - 8:00 am)

3) Install a separate meter for EV and keep house on its own meter.

Option 3 wins for me. It cost me $200 out-of-pocket to install and results in the lowest monthly electric bill for my home. By having the house on its own meter, I can always play with rate plans for the home without having to impact how I charge my vehicles. Everyone will need to do their own analysis as I recommended in my original post. Hopefully my experience can assist someone else considering installing a second meter in Southern California.

Greg Elmassian
02-11-2015, 11:50 AM
I still didn't get the math, since you say you are in tier 4 every month.

That was my issue, and except the peak time, all the other rates on the time of day are LOWER than the tier 4 rate.

So it stood to reason for me to to to TOD, and try to avoid the peak rate usage. Still saving $200 or more each month.

BUT now I see why you are better the way you are... your tiered rate plan is better than the the peak and very close to the off peak rate of the TOU plan.

That's a GREAT tiered plan, and a CRAPPY TOU plan.

Clearly, now you have shown the rates, your decision makes sense.

In Sandy Eggo, the Tiers were 22, 24, 36, and 38 cents.
The TOU plan was 20 cents or less except for the peak time... so I was basically ALWAYS getting electricity cheaper than the Tier 1, and clearly a lot less than tier 4.

The peak was 49 cents during the summer, but only 22 during the winter.

One of the few times in my life it has actually paid financially to live here!

Thanks for the final piece of the puzzle that explains it all.

Greg


I have a 3,000 sq ft home that is filled with people all day. TOD does not make sense for me. My house is on the Tier plan and car is on EV plan. I hit Tier 4 on the house very quickly each month. EV is 11 cents per kWh with a charging window between 9:00 pm and noon the next day.

DaveN007
02-11-2015, 12:36 PM
Now it makes sense.

PG&E plan:
16546
16547
16548
16549

lx.josh
04-15-2015, 12:28 AM
So the 2nd meter is connected "before" your main house meter?

How did your electrician split the main feed from SCE?
Do you happen to have a picture of inside the pull box?

I'm in Rosemead

Thanks!



Yes, I did it. It is not for the weak. It takes a lot of coordination and a lot of patience. Not to mention, around $2500 - $3000.

Here are some stats/tips:

1) I purchased a Bosch 30 amp 240V 25ft cord from Amazon. It was around $700. Get the extra length for the cord. You will be glad you did.
2) I reached out to Bosch for an estimate to install. They sent two separate contractors and i also requested a quote from a contractor I have used in the past. I highly recommend getting multiple bids.
3) Do your research. Know your home's electrical system, where you want the charger installed, what type of plan your utility will offer, and when you use your power. I live in Aracdia, CA. It made more sense for me to keep my home on the "Tier" plan and have my EV on a separate meter. You may be able to tap into your existing panel without a separate meter. Different for everyone.
4) The Bosch recommended installers were pricey. I would find an electrician you trust and go that route. Don't be fooled into thinking the manufacturer of whatever charging unit you select is better equipped to install. You will need an electrician that knows what he is doing.
5) the electrician i went with charged $1600 to install a pull box, sub-panel, meter socket, run about 75 feet of conduit to my garage, install a emergency shut-off in the garage, and wire the unit. This was not an easy job. Installing a pull box (essentially a splitter that sends power from your feed to your home panel and your EV panel) is a major task.
6) it cost another $400 to patch and repair the stucco.
7) all in, $2700. The CA rebate covered $2500 of that cost. Knowing i have 240V charging ability at home was well worth this investment in time and money. The whole process took about 3 weeks from opening my permit to getting Edison out to slide in the second meter.

Here is what I did in chronological order:

1) called Edison and told them I wanted to install a charging unit on its own meter. They sent out a planner to make sure it could be done.
2) after Edison blessing, pulled the permit with Arcadia. Cost was about $45.
3) received bids for work and selected my contractor.
4) put my contractor in touch with Edison planner so they could coordinate on what exactly needed to be done.
5) purchased Bosch unit.
6) once electrician was done, called City of Arcadia to sign off on permit and release work to Edison. City contacts Edison directly.
7) Edison came out to look at the work. Once the planner blessed it, scheduled the Edison crew to come out and tie in the line and install the meter.
8) it took Edison about 10 days to send a crew out.
9) I am up and running.

I will post some pics. If anyone has any questions about the process just post here and I will be happy to answer.

Mr_Shush
04-18-2015, 02:49 PM
So the 2nd meter is connected "before" your main house meter?

How did your electrician split the main feed from SCE?
Do you happen to have a picture of inside the pull box?

I'm in Rosemead

Thanks!

Hi Josh,

The 2nd meter is not connected before the main house meter, the main feed is diverted/split so one goes to the EV meter and the other to the house meter. I don't have any pics from inside the pullbox. Sorry.

I actually came back here to post that SCE has recently (March 2015) changed their TOU plans. With the new plans they offer, I am not sure it makes sense to make the investment in the separate meter anymore. Take a look at the new rates. The new super off peak charging window may be enough for you.

Good luck!

Mr_Shush
04-18-2015, 02:59 PM
Here are the new rates...

17432

Zapped
05-09-2015, 11:01 AM
For those that like to know how much utility power your EV is using to charge, here's a very inexpensive device that works great.
Eyedro home-electricity-monitors/ (http://eyedro.com/home-electricity-monitors/)

We have this at work for our public L2 charging station. it's very easy to install and use, provides historical detailed power usage information.

Note: I do not work for this company