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mark449
11-07-2013, 01:37 PM
Hi all, I am stuck on what I should do for the winter for my abarth.
I have 2 fiats a sport and a abarth
I have steel wheels for the winter for the sport with snow tires

I can either use the stock sport wheels and get snow tires and change them out or i can use the factory 17" wheels that i have on my abarth.
I drive about 60 miles a day to work and back on the highway ( that they don't take care of to well).
I need something that has good high speed stability.
I've always used blizzacks thats what i have for the sport and it goes like a tank, the only problem is i feel that they "wonder" to much for my liking on the highway.
I was looking at the Winter Snowcontrol Serie II is Pirelli for the sport wheels any one have them? Do you like them, how do the wear?
Also the Dunlop SP Winter Sport 3D for the sport wheels.

Any suggestions?
Thanks for the help!

FTY
11-07-2013, 07:53 PM
I placed a set of blizzaks on my 17x7.5 Neu-fs and the wandering is intolerable. The tires have a slight stretch to them increasing the wandering caused by the tread/soft compound and the stretched portion of the tire. So now I need to swap 8 tires around and order a new set of tires for the summer setup(not too thrilled about this, going to cost an additional $700 not planned for). The Pirellis may offer less wandering its definitely worth a look. I feel like a drunk on the hwy. The Blizzaks are unstoppable in the snow but am going to hold off going to a true winter setup as long as possible.

Guest
11-07-2013, 08:32 PM
Hey there, ive got the SC2s on mine right now and all last winter too. I drive 100km each way to work 90% highway driving. The SC2s are very good on the highway and much more stable, I find, than the stock Neros. I have Blizzaks on my van and whilst they are almost as good as the Pirellis I do find them louder on the highway - may be thr heavier vehicle/larger rims though!

I went down to 16s for winter and theyve seen deep powder, ice and freezing rain - all handled perfectly well. I am a bit biased as ive had SCs before, last 5yrs on previous vehicle and to be honest I wouldnt buy anything else!

ScorpionSkins.com
11-07-2013, 09:57 PM
I placed a set of blizzaks on my 17x7.5 Neu-fs and the wandering is intolerable. The tires have a slight stretch to them increasing the wandering caused by the tread/soft compound and the stretched portion of the tire. So now I need to swap 8 tires around and order a new set of tires for the summer setup(not too thrilled about this, going to cost an additional $700 not planned for). The Pirellis may offer less wandering its definitely worth a look. I feel like a drunk on the hwy. The Blizzaks are unstoppable in the snow but am going to hold off going to a true winter setup as long as possible.

That's a shame to hear. I can't find any other brand of tire that fits the factory 17s besides the Pirellis. (Which I WILL not purchase after the horrible customer service I've had trying to replace my defective PZero tires, an issue I've still not resolved)

Considering a smaller rim/tire package is also out of my budget for the moment. I have no complaints to offer of Bridgestone tires on previous vehicles otherwise.

jessebeetle
11-08-2013, 09:19 AM
I bought a set of Pirellis Serie II for my stock 16" wheels. I'll be putting them on this weekend, so I'll report back on how they feel on the highway and just regular driving. There is also a chance of us getting some snow next week, so I might be able to give them a real test too.

silky
11-08-2013, 12:23 PM
Snow tires are a pain on the Abarth.....There are only 2 205/40/17 snow tires available, no one makes a winter tire smaller than 205 in 17", and 215's are too big. I was thinking of trying 205/50/17's but they are 41 mm taller than the 205/40/17 and I just don't think they will work. I have a set of 17" rims I planned to use for winter but it almost seems my best bet is to grab a set of 16's and use the pirelli serie 2....about $1000. If I were to keep the 17's I would paying $600 just for tires.

hownowcb
11-08-2013, 05:59 PM
http://imageshack.us/scaled/large/41/bxbn.jpg

I used these Michelin X-Ice Xi2's last year and loved them! 205/50X16. Zero speedometer error, quiet, nice ride, super sticky. I put them on again two weeks ago.

Obviously, they don't have the dry grip the stock 17" Pirelli's do, but they don't wander, and it helps to "readjust" my driving style to one more suitable for winter conditions. Most people here drive like it's the 4th of July all year round, so we fill up the ditches with rolled-over SUV's pretty early in the morning on snowy days. :wink:

FTY
11-12-2013, 01:12 AM
What I've decided to do is put the Blizzaks back on the OZs (17X7) and I ended up purchasing a wider set of Falkens (215/40/17s) for the Neu-fs. The OZs will be my dedicated snow wheels and the Neu-fs will be my dedicated summer tires. This way I can have my rally look in the winter and street look in the summer.

Running a stretched snow tire wasn't my intention but it ended up that way and is not recommended wandering was increased drastically due to numerous laws of physics. Learn from my foolishness. :)

mark449
11-12-2013, 09:29 AM
What size are your blizzaks? do you know if you can go up a size without rubbing?

mark449
11-12-2013, 12:51 PM
I currently waiting for my tires to be installed on my stock sport wheels I went with the blizzaks

smhreed
11-18-2013, 08:34 PM
Has anyone tried the Costco black steel rim 15" for snows? Toronto, Canada

FTY
11-18-2013, 09:38 PM
What size are your blizzaks? do you know if you can go up a size without rubbing?

The Blizzaks are 205/40/17. Not entirely sure about the upsizing, sorry.

Tweak
11-18-2013, 10:47 PM
Has anyone tried the Costco black steel rim 15" for snows? Toronto, Canada

Welcome to the forum. Sorry cannot help with the tire or snow related question.

jessebeetle
11-21-2013, 06:18 PM
Just wanted to update and say that the Pirellis Serie II tires are actually pretty nice on the highway. They were pretty darn quiet on my trip from PA to DC this last week, and I averaged 35.6 mpg with them, which is the highest mpg I've seen. No drama, no wandering, plenty of 80+ mph driving.

I still have yet to see how they do in actual snow though.

DuckDodgers
11-22-2013, 01:08 PM
Has anyone tried the Costco black steel rim 15" for snows? Toronto, Canada

Another snow tire thread contained a note from a tire/wheel seller that the 15" rims did not clear the brakes. Your mileage may vary...be sure you can test or return.

mark449
11-24-2013, 09:40 AM
I put on 205 55 16 on stock sport wheels. They will rub a tiny bit under hard G out situations. Now I'm at stock height, and I have rally armor flaps and I'm pretty sure its hitting them.

So that is the biggest you can go at stock height if anyone was wondering lol

DuckDodgers
11-24-2013, 11:59 AM
I put on 205 55 16 on stock sport wheels. They will rub a tiny bit under hard G out situations. Now I'm at stock height, and I have rally armor flaps and I'm pretty sure its hitting them.

So that is the biggest you can go at stock height if anyone was wondering lol


Why on earth? You're looking at about 10% over stock rolling size and actually are over stock height by about 1.5". Also, for snow tires, you want narrower, not wider. 195 45 16 is your 16" stock, and should be the widest snow tire you'd consider. I guess you can extend your warranty coverage a bit this way.

hownowcb
11-24-2013, 12:51 PM
Why on earth?

Perhaps living in Texas leaves you slightly less qualified to speak on winter tires? I, too, believe that narrower tires work better in snow, but good luck trying to find them anymore! I thought I was nuts buying winter tires with a 50 aspect ratio, but they've performed flawlessly in up to 8 inches of snow. The tread pattern doesn't even look like what old school snow tires used to, but apparently, technology has changed dramatically, because they grip like crazy.

Even here in the snowbelt, we're actually driving on dry pavement 99.9% of the winter, so having winter tires that more closely resemble our summer tires' size and shape isn't so wrong as we used to think.

mark449
11-24-2013, 07:32 PM
My abarth has the 17inch wheels stock and they are 205. The difference in the with is really not going to make or break the cars snow performance.
Secondly, the tires were 98.xx each installed compared to the "correct" sized tires 150.xx installed so I saved 200.
Third, everyone now knows that you cant go any bigger with rubbing all the time, or modifying the fender liners.

I must be one of those people who set the world on fire just to watch it burn.
Thats why on the earth my friend

DuckDodgers
11-25-2013, 08:39 PM
My abarth has the 17inch wheels stock and they are 205...

Yes, 205/40...which means the tires width is 40% of 205mm, or 82mm. your snow tires are 55% of 205mm, or 112.75mm. Basically, you just widened your tires by about 30.75mm (almost 1.5' for the metric impaired). That's where your rubbing is coming from. The correct tire in a 55 aspect ratio is at 155, believe it or not.

hownowcb...I'm commenting on the tire sizing and the illogical upsizing for a snow tire. Snow tire downsizing is based upon several factors:

1) A larger aspect ratio tire (say 50-60) is wider and taller than the same tire in a sport aspect (40-45).

2) Narrower tires work better in snow...but as you noted, snow tires are improving all the time. However, it's simple physics that dictate the advantage of a narrower tire.

3) Narrower and smaller tires more easily make the total height of the tire match the stock tire with it's wider tread and shorter sidewall.

4) Snow can pack wheel wells. A narrower tire in stock or smaller rolling diameter can more effectively keep the wheelwell clearer. A larger tire the contacts the bodywork is just going to pack in more snow in the unswept areas of the wheel well.

5) Chains, if needed, CANNOT be fitted on a tire whose rolling diameter or sidth is greater than stock without a very good chance of damage.

As a side note, 195/45-16 snow tires are available from Tire Rack at $93 each. It's a shame the Abarth can't effectively use 15" winter tires, but at least keeping stock rolling diameter and aspect is a good compromise.

Crazy Otto
12-04-2013, 08:50 PM
Yes, 205/40...which means the tires width is 40% of 205mm, or 82mm. your snow tires are 55% of 205mm, or 112.75mm. Basically, you just widened your tires by about 30.75mm (almost 1.5' for the metric impaired). That's where your rubbing is coming from. The correct tire in a 55 aspect ratio is at 155, believe it or not.

hownowcb...I'm commenting on the tire sizing and the illogical upsizing for a snow tire. Snow tire downsizing is based upon several factors:

1) A larger aspect ratio tire (say 50-60) is wider and taller than the same tire in a sport aspect (40-45).

2) Narrower tires work better in snow...but as you noted, snow tires are improving all the time. However, it's simple physics that dictate the advantage of a narrower tire.

3) Narrower and smaller tires more easily make the total height of the tire match the stock tire with it's wider tread and shorter sidewall.

4) Snow can pack wheel wells. A narrower tire in stock or smaller rolling diameter can more effectively keep the wheelwell clearer. A larger tire the contacts the bodywork is just going to pack in more snow in the unswept areas of the wheel well.

5) Chains, if needed, CANNOT be fitted on a tire whose rolling diameter or sidth is greater than stock without a very good chance of damage.

As a side note, 195/45-16 snow tires are available from Tire Rack at $93 each. It's a shame the Abarth can't effectively use 15" winter tires, but at least keeping stock rolling diameter and aspect is a good compromise.

Increasing aspect ratio does not increase width.

Dont confuse the derived width of the tire with actual tread width.

Go take a look at the blizzak 205/40-17 dimensions on tire rack. The actual tread width is 6 inches and change. About 1.5 inches narrower than a summer performnace tire in exactly the same size.

Felnus
12-04-2013, 09:44 PM
Yep, the Duck has it backwards. http://www.howstuffworks.com/tire2.htm

He is correct in that you want to run a narrower snow tire than you would an all season or summer tire. On my '06 Ford Focus, for example, the stock tire size was 195/60-15 but I used 185/65-15 snow tires. The narrower tire with the higher aspect ratio maintained the correct circumference so my speedometer was still reading correctly.

Crazy Otto
12-04-2013, 10:30 PM
The math is easy. Take the width x aspect ratio x 2 then divide by 25.4 then add rim diameter for overall tire height. 205 40-17 is 205 x2x .4 / 25.4 + 17.

james4513
12-05-2013, 11:40 AM
Check your private messages. I have a set of new snow tires and wheels for sale and sent you a message.

DuckDodgers
12-05-2013, 12:02 PM
Yep, the Duck has it backwards. http://www.howstuffworks.com/tire2.htm


Guilty! I did the math off the top of my head and reversed the fields. The sectional height is indeed a percentage of the width, thus a 70 tire has a sidewall that is 70% of the width. Damn, gotta quit posting after a shift!

Crazy Otto
12-08-2013, 11:43 AM
Guilty! I did the math off the top of my head and reversed the fields. The sectional height is indeed a percentage of the width, thus a 70 tire has a sidewall that is 70% of the width. Damn, gotta quit posting after a shift!

I am more lucid after a sh*t, no problems posting at all. In fact, I make my best posts during the process.

O wait. I now see you said shift.

jessebeetle
12-08-2013, 05:59 PM
Update: Got to try out the Pirelli Serie II in the PA wintery mess today and they are actually very good. Grippier than the Dunlop Winter Sport 3d's I had on my WRX, although that could partially be due to the narrow 195 tires cutting through the snow. Overall, very pleased :-)