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rnddude
10-09-2013, 05:12 PM
When my co-worker and I got excited about this car, we both opted to buy, mostly to get the $7500 tax credit that you don't get with a lease. Our dealer said we were the first to buy, everyone else had leased. In fact, I have found no others that have purchased either. Anyone else go the purchase route?

rcboosted
10-09-2013, 06:06 PM
When my co-worker and I got excited about this car, we both opted to buy, mostly to get the $7500 tax credit that you don't get with a lease. Our dealer said we were the first to buy, everyone else had leased. In fact, I have found no others that have purchased either. Anyone else go the purchase route?

I leased, because I don't know what the state of the EV will be in 3 years, it's still in a rapid state of change. I also don't know how long the batteries will last. The lease is cheap enough to offset my monthly commute fuel cost, plus I get HOV, it was a no brainer for me. This is all for my particular situation.

ABARTH TAMER
10-09-2013, 06:15 PM
Purchase

Andree
10-09-2013, 07:33 PM
Purchase

You have a 500e and an Abarth?

silversport
10-10-2013, 10:44 AM
I purchased my e (but I am the other guy you are referring to)....

I think that we are the only two!

SanDiegoDana
10-13-2013, 07:55 PM
I prefer purchase to lease by 1000x but I think the fiat electric that will be available in 3 years will be better (and the end-of-lease value is SO high: Chrysler financial is going to take a HUGE hit I think!) that the lease was un-beatable, this time around.

CjDaniel
08-02-2014, 03:41 PM
I leased to keep my payments low, and ease of return. It is a third car at our household. I have never leased before.

Prost
08-03-2014, 12:20 PM
I leased, it's my third car and use it mostly to commute...I also think in three year, EV will be much different then today...lease is the way to go...especially that this monthly payment

dmb
09-29-2014, 01:45 PM
Considering how much EV battery technology has evolved in the last three years, I didn't want to find myself in three years' time with a car that couldn't compete against similarly priced new cars having greater range, so we decided to lease.

Less than a week later, Tesla announced plans to release a $35K model with more than 200 miles' range in 2017, so I felt pretty good about the decision.

That said, I've loved driving my 500e. I hope I'll love it even more when I get it back from the dealership. We're up to two weeks, now, and no word on when I can expect to see it again—apparently the inverter for my 2014 has to be MANUFACTURED.

Zapped
09-30-2014, 12:41 AM
Good call on the lease.
I drive a Model S and my wife fell for the FIAT 500e. The whole electric drive experience is very similar (except for the HP and a few other things ..... :onthego:)
For short trips around town the FIAT is great and well within the 90 mile range for our use.

TESLA has been know to slip on delivery dates. 2017 might be a bit optimistic but at least we'll be saving on fuel for the next 2-3 years and having a fun drive at the same time.

Greg Elmassian
09-30-2014, 09:52 PM
You can get the $7,500 federal rebate with either purchase or lease. In most cases, when you lease the dealer fronts you the rebate money to reduce the vehicle cost, so you reduce your lease cost.

I leased.

Greg



When my co-worker and I got excited about this car, we both opted to buy, mostly to get the $7500 tax credit that you don't get with a lease. Our dealer said we were the first to buy, everyone else had leased. In fact, I have found no others that have purchased either. Anyone else go the purchase route?

ChrisPDX
10-03-2014, 10:57 AM
I leased as well. I hate to say it, but the 500e is way overpriced! We also looked at a Focus EV and it was thousands of dollars less and was better equipped. If it wasn't for the good leasing terms from Fiat, I would have purchased the Focus instead. The other thing that scared me away from purchasing a 500e was how they clearly don't want to sell the car. You just know that once they can legally stop supporting and selling parts for it, they will. You pretty much have this risk when buying any "compliance car".

Still, the 500e is a fun car to drive and my wife loves it (it's mostly her car). The lease was a great deal, so I'm still very happy I got it.

Greg Elmassian
10-03-2014, 07:58 PM
You know, list price means nothing, it's what you have to pay for something is what the price really is.

I would say that in my opinion, the quality of the drivetrain, motor, and electronics is above the Ford.

Greg

ChrisPDX
10-04-2014, 01:05 PM
True, list price is only a starting point. However for about $2-3k less, the Focus EV also comes with dual zone climate control with cabin air filter, a real navigation system, telescopic steering wheel (not just tilt), backup camera, bigger display, power driver's seat, better sound system, two more doors, and keyless entry/ignition. You would need to get Fiat to knock a lot off the price to make it a better deal while just accepting the Ford price There's a reason why almost nobody buys them.

However, when it comes to the lease, I was quoted about $70 more per month for the Focus EV. Between that and the Fiat having a better "cute factor" with my wife, we went with the Fiat. The only thing the Focus EV has against it is the lack of battery cooling. Without a DC quick charge however, this is only really an issue if you live in a very hot climate.

Please, don't get me wrong. I love the Fiat. It's a great little car and does exactly what we need of it. But if I was in the market to purchase a car, then I probably would have gone with a different EV.

Greg Elmassian
10-04-2014, 10:05 PM
I think you need the battery cooling for charging on a level 2 charger, also helps on discharge.

Like I said, I think the technology of the main drive system and electronics is better, the other trim and power options are a different story, yes would be nice to have a power driver's seat, etc, but I'll take the better main propulsion system. So, I do not find them comparable, or that the Focus is a way better deal. But, that's just my personal set of priorities.

Regards, Greg

ChrisPDX
10-05-2014, 12:52 PM
Level 2s are too slow to usually require cooling. For the 500e, we are talking a charge rate of about C/4 which is pretty slow for Lithium Ion. Remember, they both have heaters for a reason as they need to be warm to a point to not be damaged while charging. It's only when you get into the 1C+ charging rates that they start kicking out a lot of heat and need cooling. Leafs do this on CHAdeMo which is why they aren't doing so well in hot climates. But without that on either, I don't think it's a big concern. Especially up here in Oregon!

Yep, different set of personal priorities when it comes to options. I totally get that.

Greg Elmassian
10-05-2014, 04:19 PM
I understand the battery is a 24 kwh battery, and so I agree you are at about C/4. But maybe the regen kicks it up, or the cooling just increases battery life, or the density of the pack requires it.

Seems strange it was included for no good reason, it had to add significant cost.

Greg

ChrisPDX
10-05-2014, 06:47 PM
I was honestly surprised to learn the Fiat has cooling and the Focus EV doesn't. For a company that has no interest in EVs and doesn't want you to buy them, I was shocked that they actually bothered with the cooling. Maybe it's because Bosch only designed systems with it and therefore required it??? Do you know of any other EVs that use the Bosch system that might confirm this?

Cooling really isn't normally required in most situations, even regenerative breaking. You have to be going down a vary big hill to generate 1C+ of energy for an extended time to where the battery really heats up. Only in high heat areas do owners see their EVs start limiting performance/regen due to a hot battery. If you look at Leafs which also lack cooling and have been out for many years now do you start seeing battery degradation being accelerated in high heat areas. Owners in normal and cooler climates haven't had much of a problem.

Greg Elmassian
10-07-2014, 10:47 AM
Perhaps you are in error about the ford focus battery, read this link that says it has active liquid cooling.

http://www.pluginamerica.org/vehicles/ford-focus-electric

Regards, Greg

ChrisPDX
10-07-2014, 11:00 AM
Wow, you are right. I just confirmed off Ford's web site that it does indeed have liquid cooling. I must have misread that somewhere. Sorry about the confusion. I guess that makes the Focus EV an even better deal then before! :)

That leaves the Leaf and eGolf as the non-liquid cooled ones. Not sure about the Kia yet.

Greg Elmassian
10-07-2014, 12:55 PM
Interesting on the Leaf from Wikipedia:

In June 2014 Nissan USA announced an updated battery replacement program allowing the outright purchase of a new battery pack for US$5,499. The price does not include labor and the trade-in of the old pack is mandatory. Older 2011–12 model year Leafs will require a mounting kit to retrofit the new pack for an additional US$225. The new pack will be the same as the one in the 2015 model year Leaf, with the latest battery chemistry which Nissan claims will be more heat tolerant. Financing for the replacement battery will be announced by the end of 2014