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View Full Version : Engine light keeps coming on, Coolant circuit 1



ultramagnus
06-21-2013, 10:40 AM
Hey Guys,

I really love my car, It is my first one I owned since new and I want it to stay healthy. It is a 2013 Abarth.

At 300km, engine light came on, I don't have the code but it read Engine coolant temperature sensor Circuit 1.

The dealer cleared the fault and gave the car back to me saying they checked everything.

500km, engine light came on, Same issue, this time they said they replaced the sensor.

now just hitting 900, it is on again, and same fault, now they are trying to blame me for my ATM Intake on the car.
I am stuck in a hard place because I work for the same owner who has multiple car dealerships, one is the one I work at and the Fiat was bought at the dealership he owns. So I cannot go guns blazing now because I am worried about my job, but they are taking a very relaxed and passive attitude toward me.
At BMW where I work, if a customer returns after a repair, the car goes on high priority, a 3rd time and now, it hits the fan and everything gets pushed aside, me I had to wait a week just to get it back in saying "its not an emergency". Who determines that? Who can tell me just because the car drives fine that it is totally safe to drive?

Sorry I am ranting, just wanted to hear what you guys think.

Ryephile
06-21-2013, 11:16 AM
Can you escalate the situation relatively anonymously with a local or regional service manager? ...or go to a different dealership under the explanation that the one you went to previously failed to intelligently diagnose the problem?

Clearly something is wrong, likely with the ECU, and it's classic dealership ignorance to blame an air filter on a coolant sensor related problem. Chances are it's a P011x code, and which one will narrow down what the problem is. It would also make sense at this time to datalog your ECTs to track if the car is having actual cooling troubles or if it's electronic-only. There are only 3 things in the electrical circuit that are serviceable; the ECU, the wiring, and the sensor.

ultramagnus
06-21-2013, 11:23 AM
The thing is I cannot put enough emphasis on how I am being treated by apparently fellow employees, I am being civil and nice and cooperative, but the neglect is astounding especially on how we deal with repeat issues here at our dealer.

I am so dissapointed. I really like the car but feel now that I have a lemon. I have had rattling issues from my front dash area that they said was a defroster flap that has now returned to being noisy at about 3500rpm in 3rd , 4th, 5th. I mean I dont even have 1000km's on the car and the dealer has seen the car more then me.

The gauge on the dash reads normal, it stays at the middle but I will see if my scanner can tell me actual temperature readings.

FTY
06-21-2013, 02:54 PM
Its a shame that you have to work there and basically put up with the BS, doesn't make things any easier. Ryephile is 100% correct, those are the only things that should be causing the fault. Id also try another FIAT dealership, one that is preferably "MOD" friendly, they do exist.

Tony S
06-23-2013, 09:32 AM
Why don't you put the stock intake on just to prove them wrong?

ultramagnus
06-23-2013, 01:00 PM
I have, but Tony it is not just the fact of the intake or not, it is how I am being treated on a practically new car. I told them I do not have another car and need one but tell me only customers of the highest importance get one , blah blah blah, and also the fact that I know some of the staff there because they have either been shuffled from our dealership or met them at events.

Abarth Phreak
06-23-2013, 02:48 PM
PM fiatCAcares...

ultramagnus
07-01-2013, 06:48 PM
So just to update,
I have now returned the old air box on and the light has returned. So this will be the fourth time the light comes on.

I have read their old statement, the code is p0116.
I am in contact with FiatCAcares, and has been helpful. I will be returning to my studio tomorrow morning. Again I will be out of a car and try having to figure out transportation. This is frustrating.

Guest
07-01-2013, 10:05 PM
Good luck. Surely just a faulty thermistor or something mundane. If the coolant level is good and the temperature is in tolerance then have a little comfort that its nothing major and youll be up and running soon. Which dealer are you using now? Any more helpful?

dart1.4t
07-06-2013, 01:00 AM
seems this code can be triggered by too fast a change in reading. temperature changes happen slowly and the ecu expects to see that. you cah locate the sensor and check for 5v unloaded and it may drop with the sensor attached. the sensor is a thermistor, basically it is read by making it a part of a resistor network, either it is fed regulated 5v and there is a resistor to ground on the return path or it is grounded and fed 5v through a calibrated resistor. testing the wiring can be tricky because the voltage across the leads is a range that depends on temperature. you may have to get creative. i think it's the 5v+ that gets the resistor and the other lead is direct to ground. if this is the case it's easy to test the return path. with the key in the run position and with the sensor connected or a resistor between the leads check the voltage differential from the return wire to the ground of the car. it should read 0, you can read the ohms without the sensor but it's not as reliable as reading voltage drop loaded. checking the 5v can be tricky to test the specific wire unless you have a friend and really long leads, basically you would check, with the sensor or a test resistor in place the voltage from the 5v positive supply on the sensor to the specific pin on the ecu should read 0 or atleast very low. if we know the value or the pull up resistor then we can do all the testing under the hood because we can calculate what voltages should be under the test conditions. it's good to have a real service manual or "all data" for that.

if the circuit is good under normal conditions it can still be intermittent. check the voltage across the leads with the sensor or a test resistor attached between them and have a friend start moving all the wiring between the sensor and ecu. this can be especially hard to find if it is a short between 2 5v supply wires for different sensors.

in a well engineered system it may be possible to short the sensor wires together without blowing the pull up or pull down resistor but i wouldn't risk it if i could avoid it. i'd use the sensor or a resistor close to the sensors ambient temperature resistance reading so that i'd have access to the conductors without probing through the insulation.

ultramagnus
07-08-2013, 05:51 PM
Thanks for that info, and the help.
Right now they have had my car for some time now. It has been shuffled to another dealer to get it looked at by more people. I don't know now, but I was told it was throwing a different code out to them when I brought it back with the engine light on for the 4th time. Being so intermittent I don't know how they are tackling the issue besides grabbing another Abarth and testing readings out of the sensor, and the sensor to the PCM and then comparing the two to each other.

I put everything back to stock so they could eliminate that issue. I am just so worried about the car now. So many people have been digging into it and it is so new (1100km's), people at work keep mocking me that it will never be the same after being torn apart so many times. I would like to disagree with that as I work on car's as well and I always try to put the car back together BETTER then how it was assembled from the factory, but again, that is just how I work and I know that my fellow tech's don't always share that same method of madness.

chrisnov500
07-10-2013, 11:45 PM
Thanks for that info, and the help.
Right now they have had my car for some time now. It has been shuffled to another dealer to get it looked at by more people. I don't know now, but I was told it was throwing a different code out to them when I brought it back with the engine light on for the 4th time. Being so intermittent I don't know how they are tackling the issue besides grabbing another Abarth and testing readings out of the sensor, and the sensor to the PCM and then comparing the two to each other.

I put everything back to stock so they could eliminate that issue. I am just so worried about the car now. So many people have been digging into it and it is so new (1100km's), people at work keep mocking me that it will never be the same after being torn apart so many times. I would like to disagree with that as I work on car's as well and I always try to put the car back together BETTER then how it was assembled from the factory, but again, that is just how I work and I know that my fellow tech's don't always share that same method of madness.

I sincerely thank you for your work ethic and heart on what you do. I wish people who is in service should have your work ethic in their minds and actually care for what they do.
I hope that your issue will be resolved and soon, you will enjoy awesome Abarth!

Happy motoring!

ultramagnus
08-12-2013, 10:27 AM
I guess I have not been keeping you guys updated. But the car was at the studio for 3 weeks and they put over 60 km.

The report that I can see and I would love to post it is that they replaced a wiring harness from the headlight to the engine, and road tested it.

I have now had the car for the week, did a really low milage oil change which I was really looking forward to doing myself. I then performed about 3 highway trips to work, can you guess what happens next?

yes.

it is now on again. I will be bringing it back, this will be my 5th visit for the same concern.

I am at a loss here now. 5 times. I have 1900km's on it only.

BigDaddySRT
08-12-2013, 12:00 PM
I guess I have not been keeping you guys updated. But the car was at the studio for 3 weeks and they put over 60 km.

The report that I can see and I would love to post it is that they replaced a wiring harness from the headlight to the engine, and road tested it.

I have now had the car for the week, did a really low milage oil change which I was really looking forward to doing myself. I then performed about 3 highway trips to work, can you guess what happens next?

yes.

it is now on again. I will be bringing it back, this will be my 5th visit for the same concern.

I am at a loss here now. 5 times. I have 1900km's on it only.

If they have it recorded on their records of 5 visits, and 5 repairs for the exact same problem... you might want to start speaking with the Studio Manager about getting a completely different/ new ABARTH.

500ways
08-12-2013, 12:26 PM
I guess I have not been keeping you guys updated. But the car was at the studio for 3 weeks and they put over 60 km.

The report that I can see and I would love to post it is that they replaced a wiring harness from the headlight to the engine, and road tested it.

I have now had the car for the week, did a really low milage oil change which I was really looking forward to doing myself. I then performed about 3 highway trips to work, can you guess what happens next?

yes.

it is now on again. I will be bringing it back, this will be my 5th visit for the same concern.

I am at a loss here now. 5 times. I have 1900km's on it only.

Does Canada have a "lemon law"? If so, this may qualify.

trevc
08-12-2013, 01:02 PM
If the techs attended the correct training and are certified there is a technical help line at Fiat they can call to get assistance diagnosing and repairing issues.
First thing the Tech does at my studio is call them to check for known problems / solutions.
I wonder if they are just trying to 'guess' by themselves?


I guess I have not been keeping you guys updated. But the car was at the studio for 3 weeks and they put over 60 km.

The report that I can see and I would love to post it is that they replaced a wiring harness from the headlight to the engine, and road tested it.

I have now had the car for the week, did a really low milage oil change which I was really looking forward to doing myself. I then performed about 3 highway trips to work, can you guess what happens next?

yes.

it is now on again. I will be bringing it back, this will be my 5th visit for the same concern.

I am at a loss here now. 5 times. I have 1900km's on it only.

ultramagnus
08-12-2013, 02:03 PM
Yes where I work as well (BMW) we have a technical department we can resource if we so need.

By reading the work order, it appears they have contacted the department. I would love to post the report but I do not want to get into any trouble if it were possible to get into any.

I just only speak to this forum as you guys offer the most information and insightful knowledge where other places would just troll me.

SLOWAbarth
08-14-2013, 09:29 PM
We have this lovely thing in the states called Magnuson–Moss Warranty Act. I don't think it applies in Canada but bring it up...In a nut shell, they would have to prove that your intake is a direct relation to your coolant system error. If they are still giving you crap about it, I would kindly ask if they can prove that your intake pipe and filter could disrupt the coolant system.

I had to Lemon my first Abarth...after we spent months looking for the issues, it ended up being something small and dumb but was still sketchy. All good now and I still love the Abarth but Good LUCK!

ultramagnus
08-15-2013, 10:39 AM
It really just boils down to a cumulative effect.

First I was told really it was nothing, then I was told it was my intake and I was forced to put it to stock which I did as we all know had nothing to do with a coolant circuit. Then for some reason they suspected I had an aftermarket ECU installed for performance, and the last one was the anti-corrosion thingy I have attached to my battery.

I do love the car, it was my first and I really wanted it to be special. But from day one, it has nothing been but a sore for me and this whole experience including individuals involved with it have let me down. It would have been so nice to be told that my car would be repaired with no issues and everything would be done to get it fixed rather then telling me that I did things to cause the issues. I don't do that when I fix cars, I understand that vehicles can break, that's why I am employed, so I can fix them again.